beef Posted October 6, 2008 Share Posted October 6, 2008 I think the fact the paper saving ability has not been jammed down our throats because people may be getting tired of hearing how EVERYTHING is going to end the world, I know I am. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Talisman Posted October 6, 2008 Share Posted October 6, 2008 It is not about ramming it down our throats Beef, just about raising awareness that's all. Thousands of books are pulped in this country every year, and we all need to do our bit ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charm Posted October 6, 2008 Share Posted October 6, 2008 Just to throw a spanner in the works! I have to say I don Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Janet Posted October 7, 2008 Share Posted October 7, 2008 Having said all that I do believe they would be useful in the right situations ie schools, work or people with disabilities etc, but I for one will be sticking to good old paperbacks .... for the time being! Me too! My friend's hubby had one for his birthday. He has a neurological condition which means that holding books for any length of time is a problem. This enables him to continue his love of reading. In that situation I think they're a Godsend, but I can't imagine not having my bookshelves. To me, having books in my lounge helps to dress it - I'd feel almost bereft without them! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Talisman Posted October 7, 2008 Share Posted October 7, 2008 (edited) There are some valid points there Charm, I have to admit - unfortuantely knowing the publishing industry like I do though most books are not printed on recycled paper (although more are than used to be), and neither are they printed locally. They are printed, like the E-reader in the Far East, using chemical laden inks. It is also common place to print far too many of them - so vast amounts end up being pulped. I realise it is difficult to know how many should be printed, but there are alternatives to lithographic printing, which are similarly priced - print on demand for one. There are many advantages to this method, for both author and publisher - ease of making changes, faster turnaround - no warehousing fees to worry about either. Cynic as I am, I still think that this is the main reason for hostility towards POD - and E-books by the industry - they fear (and quite rightly so) that it will lead to job losses - for the middle men will no longer be needed. That though is a few years down the line. Although I find the idea of helping charity appealing by giving old books to charity shops etc, authors also have to live. I would love to be able to write full time, but it is very hard to live on that, so I have to work elsewhere. Personally then I quite like the idea of people not being able to pass my books around - if they want one, let them buy it - it is good to help charity, but authors are not charities themselves ... It is very easy after all to lend books to friends, but would you lend them your E-reader? The industry needs to put safeguards in place to make sure that authors are adequately compensated for their work when it is downloaded and formatted as E-books. If they don't then we may see a repeat of the Writers Guilds strike, not by Hollywood, but by authors. Edited October 7, 2008 by Talisman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michelle Posted October 7, 2008 Share Posted October 7, 2008 There does seem to be a lot of arguments around whether we'd be better of with books OR ebooks, whereas I see a place for both. I don't want to give up books in general, but I think the e-reader could be very useful. I'd happily (if I could afford it!) have both side by side. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Icecream Posted October 7, 2008 Share Posted October 7, 2008 Charm - you took the words right ot of my mouth. OH and I were talking about the same environmental points last night. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charm Posted October 7, 2008 Share Posted October 7, 2008 I do see your point Talisman about the cost to the industry but unfortunately every industry has its problems from the music business to the perfume business. If a person can go online and download music or a film for nothing illegally, whats to stop them doing the same thing with online books or even your full collection of books? We've all heard the trouble the music industry has had but it still goes on. Then not everyone can afford to buy e-readers, I know its a luxury I couldn't afford. Not everyone can even afford to buy books from new and although I understand your plight and sympathise, does that mean you disagree with libraries or bookrings for example or any other scheme to borrow or pass on your books? I would imagine it would be of greater good to you to let others read your work and create more of a fan base and perhaps increase the amount of people who would actually go out and buy your books. But hey I'm rambling again - sorry! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Talisman Posted October 7, 2008 Share Posted October 7, 2008 I have nothing against libraries at all Charm - in fact I would much rather people do borrow my book that way than from a friend, as at least I get paid - twice in fact, once when the library buys the book, and again (the princely sum of 5pence) every time someone borrows it ! I understand what you are saying about not everyone being able to afford books, but if writers are not adequately compensated, then we can't afford to write them either - we have to live on something and personally I couldn't imagine a world without books ! We have had this discussion before on here anyway, and it went round in circles then, so perhaps we should get back to discussing E-readers. It is one of those things that everyone is bound to have different opinions of to keep going round gets us nowhere ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beef Posted October 7, 2008 Share Posted October 7, 2008 I do see your point Talisman about the cost to the industry but unfortunately every industry has its problems from the music business to the perfume business. If a person can go online and download music or a film for nothing illegally, whats to stop them doing the same thing with online books or even your full collection of books? We've all heard the trouble the music industry has had but it still goes on. Then not everyone can afford to buy e-readers, I know its a luxury I couldn't afford. Not everyone can even afford to buy books from new and although I understand your plight and sympathise, does that mean you disagree with libraries or bookrings for example or any other scheme to borrow or pass on your books? I would imagine it would be of greater good to you to let others read your work and create more of a fan base and perhaps increase the amount of people who would actually go out and buy your books. But hey I'm rambling again - sorry! It is not illegal to download for personal usage. it is *uploading* thats the illegal part. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charm Posted October 7, 2008 Share Posted October 7, 2008 I have nothing against libraries at all Charm - in fact I would much rather people do borrow my book that way than from a friend, as at least I get paid - twice in fact, once when the library buys the book, and again (the princely sum of 5pence) every time someone borrows it ! I understand what you are saying about not everyone being able to afford books, but if writers are not adequately compensated, then we can't afford to write them either - we have to live on something and personally I couldn't imagine a world without books ! We have had this discussion before on here anyway, and it went round in circles then, so perhaps we should get back to discussing E-readers. It is one of those things that everyone is bound to have different opinions of to keep going round gets us nowhere ... I thought I was discussing the cost of e-readers and how they could potentially harm your sales however I have to agree we could go round in circles all day. I'm relatively new here and didn't realise it had been discussed before (I should really learn to search the site more:blush:). My apologies if I annoyed you or offended you in any way, that was not my intention. I do understand your point of view and was just trying to take part in the discussion. IMHO I'm not opposed to e-readers and as I've said before I think they could be of benefit in certain circumstances. I personally would prefer a book and couldn't imagine a world without them either!. It is not illegal to download for personal usage. it is *uploading* thats the illegal part. As far as I'm aware that is not the case in all countries - but I could be wrong! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beef Posted October 7, 2008 Share Posted October 7, 2008 I thought I was discussing the cost of e-readers and how they could potentially harm your sales however I have to agree we could go round in circles all day. I'm relatively new here and didn't realise it had been discussed before (I should really learn to search the site more:blush:). My apologies if I annoyed you or offended you in any way, that was not my intention. I do understand your point of view and was just trying to take part in the discussion. IMHO I'm not opposed to e-readers and as I've said before I think they could be of benefit in certain circumstances. I personally would prefer a book and couldn't imagine a world without them either!. As far as I'm aware that is not the case in all countries - but I could be wrong! I meant in the uk, however generally that is the case, downloading is at worst a civil offense not a criminal one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Talisman Posted October 7, 2008 Share Posted October 7, 2008 No offence taken Charm, I was just wanting to get back to the spirit of the thread, that's all - you didn't offend me in any way - I am way past that! It is good to discuss these things anyway and get them out in the open. As for the legal issues re downloading - it depends on the copyright conditions and the type of license used. If the book is issued under the creative commons license (there are several types) then no problem, as it means that it can be downloaded free of charge and quoted freely in other books for example, or used as course material for universities etc. The creative commons license is though a fairly new thing, and not many books as yet have it. Mine doesn't and there are only one or two other authors I know that use this. Personally I have no issue with someone quoting my work anyway - several have asked, as long as they credit the source and if it is a large amount of text, send me a free copy of their work so I can check what they have done. This is what the big publishers do, so if it's good enough (and works) for them, then it's good enough for me ! At the end of the day it is about honouring the work that has gone into creating that book - this is not just for books I hasten to add, but anything creative. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nellie Posted October 7, 2008 Share Posted October 7, 2008 There does seem to be a lot of arguments around whether we'd be better of with books OR ebooks, whereas I see a place for both. I don't want to give up books in general, but I think the e-reader could be very useful. I'd happily (if I could afford it!) have both side by side. Thats how I feel, and given my medical issues, it really has been marvellous over the last couple of weeks when reading a paper based book has been very hard. I have read that a library in London has started an e-book library. I have no idea how it works in detail, but the idea is that you download your e-book, read it, and then have to "return it". From what I have seen of the copyright stuff on the software that came with the E-reader, when you download the book, the copyright is restricted to your PC and reader. I couldn't for example copy the file to my husband's PC and read it from there. It only works on my PC and reader. I would imagine that the e-library works in the same way. You temporarily get the copyright files which allow you to read the book, but not keep it. I like the idea of being able to borrow e-books. Maybe that will come in time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nici Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 I think it would be fantastic for school children. Robbie's bag is so heavy because of all the books he has to lug to school every day. Also I reckon Robbie would read more if it was on a 'gadget'. Me, however I still like my books on a bookshelf! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beef Posted October 8, 2008 Share Posted October 8, 2008 I think it would be fantastic for school children. Robbie's bag is so heavy because of all the books he has to lug to school every day. Also I reckon Robbie would read more if it was on a 'gadget'. Me, however I still like my books on a bookshelf! I remember being told the same thing when our school got computers "all anyone will have to carry a year from now is a floppy disk"..still waiting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lexiepiper Posted December 22, 2008 Share Posted December 22, 2008 Like someone else mentioned earlier, i do prefer my books in paper form, purely as a way to get away from the computer, with so many digital things, it surely can't be good for your eyes to constantly be looking at bright screens, that's my opinion anyway Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ernie Posted December 22, 2008 Share Posted December 22, 2008 I agree with what most are saying that books will never be replaced, but being a gadget lover, I WANT ONE. The Amazon Kindle is Oprahs favourite gadget so that is good enough for me I am attracted to the kindle / Sony Reader because I sometimes lose books or lend them to people, also the travel thing that everyone has mentioned. One selling point is that you can order a book and have it in less than a minute. Certainly publishers now seem to be making vast amounts available as electronic books. Still no sign of a kindle for the UK? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lexiepiper Posted December 22, 2008 Share Posted December 22, 2008 That's always the way though, we're always the last to get anything! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kell Posted December 22, 2008 Share Posted December 22, 2008 Still no sign of a kindle for the UK?Apparently it will be launched in the UK in the New Year... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iagegu Posted December 22, 2008 Share Posted December 22, 2008 Not sure whether I like the idea or not. I suppose it would depend on the availability of newly released books and the cost of them. Whilst I like the idea of being able to hold a physical book if I am completely honest I am running out of space to keep more. The idea of being able to hold dozens of books on a little card is something to be considered. I suppose as well if you consider the amount of paper used to publish all the books we see each year would this alternative be more environmentally friendly? Maybe something I will look at in one form or another if the prices decrease a bit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nellie Posted December 22, 2008 Share Posted December 22, 2008 Like someone else mentioned earlier, i do prefer my books in paper form, purely as a way to get away from the computer, with so many digital things, it surely can't be good for your eyes to constantly be looking at bright screens, that's my opinion anyway Thats the beauty of the SOny E-Reader, the screen isn't backlit, so it doesn't hurt your eyes. It's just like reading paper which is a bit of a shock when you first start! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lexiepiper Posted December 22, 2008 Share Posted December 22, 2008 Just had a look at the sony e-reader and it does look pretty good, thanks for the info about backlighting, it certainly makes it more appealing, shame it's so expensive for not only the reader, but the ebooks too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michelle Posted December 22, 2008 Share Posted December 22, 2008 Yes, it is a shame it's so expensive. When it comes to the ebooks, however, I'm pretty sure that it will accept all types, not just the ones sold at waterstones. There are a lot of ebboks out there that I'd like to explore, but I struggle reading them on the laptop screen, so a reader like this would be useful. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kell Posted December 22, 2008 Share Posted December 22, 2008 My Mam got the Sony Reader and it came with a disc of 100 classics - pretty decent really as even if you paid Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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