Used Books

[~Andrea~]

I'm sure many people here do both. I'll buy some books second hand and some new. I'll often put books on my xmas or birthday list (which then get bought new).

 

I am conscious of the author when I buy a book. However I may take more risk with a cheap second hand book to try out an author, then if I like them i'll buy something by them. It's only fair that an artist is rewarded for their work. But then I can afford to buy a lot of my books partly because I'm such a slow reader If I read a hundred books a year the percentage of used books would have to go up!!

 

I don't think the car analogy is the same. A book could feasibly be bought once then read by hundreds of people reflecting the only a fraction of a percent of the readership in actual sales. A car will only have a handful of owners.

[pontalba]

and pulped ...

 

I always maintain that if you really want to buy a book then you will find the money.

 

While I agree with much of what you say, I cannot agree with the above portion of your post. There are those that cannot find the money, especially 25 dollars for a new hardback. In that case they will hopefully go to the library and borrow it, and the author certainly doesn't make more money because more people borrow it from the library.

At least if the book is bought second hand it feeds the economy, second hand dealers, people selling at garage sales etc. Money is flowing and that is a good thing.

[Echo]

Honestly, I'm never going to stop buying used books. I'm not really thinking about the author, I'm thinking about the book. I like to think about who owned it, what they thought, and it sounds weird, but I even like reading the notes they write in the margins! I do buy the majority of my books new, but as a struggling college student, it's not realistic to be able to do that all the time. It's just too expensive, and being an obsessed bookworm, my appetite for book shopping is too great! And I don't like libraries, because I like to keep my books, even used ones.

[Adam]

With all due respect though Adam, and I mean this in the best possible way, until you have written and published a book you don't know how you will feel about these things .... You (or anyone else for that matter) can no more understand how I feel than I can understand how you (or anyone else) feels, for the simple reason that I am not you and you are not me!

 

Ok I get it. You write books. Good for you. You and the other writers are not the only ones who don't have money. I am just like Echo, I am in college and I don't have boat loads of money coming in. You have to understand that new books cost money. Used books are the cheaper option and you can find many great gems. If you dislike used book stores then you must really hate libraries. Writing is like anything in life. If your good you'll get paid. Look at Ricky Hatton, a world famous undefeated boxing champ. $20 million a fight. Why? Because he is good. Even authors like John Grisham get paid huge amounts of money because they are good at what they do. Talent earns money. What kind of books do you write? If it is reference or non-fiction then no you would not see the cash flow that fiction writers do.

 

I am a good writer, would I write a book? Probably not. I don't have the time. I would rather do other things with my life. If you want my sympathy and for me to feel sorry for authors who struggle to get by, sorry not going to happen. People make their choices. They are the ones choosing to work their butts off to get a book published. That is their choice. Not mine. Whether I think it is worth a read is my choice. If those authors love what they do and they are happy with their life then I don't see a problem. Money is not everything. And if they really want to write, but can't find the time or money, then let it go. It is called sacrifice. It is part of life. Some advice; let it be and have some faith. Maybe if the author wants sympathy from me they should walk through a new book store and read the prices.

[Oblomov]

The best of the used book buyers like Oblomov view it as a pleasant hobby which does not stop them from buying full priced books that they are interested in. !

I am sure that I do not deserve the complement of "best" Talisman, but you are absolutely right in stating that I consider browsing and buying seconhand books as a pleasant hobby and not an alternative to buying new books. In fact if there is a particular book that I want, I first check to see if it is avaiable new and if it is, more often than not ask my local bookshop in Wootton Bassett to get it for me. My wife is even more particular about using the local businesses than I am. I use the online facility only for very rare and out-of-print books which cannot be obtained easily otherwise.

[Talisman]

Thank for your comments Oblomov, it is good to know that there is at least one person on here who understands where I am coming from and can get their point across without throwing their toys out of their pram, just because they are challenged a bit.

 

As for Adam, I don't know about authors having sympathy for poor students, but if you want me to understand you then quite frankly you should learn some manners. There is no need to make this personal by making comments such as okay I get if, you write books, good for you. If it wasn't for the likes of me who yes, make a choice as to whether to do this, then you couldn't be student in the first place, as someone had to write your course material.

 

As for your ridiculous comment that talent earns money - sadly you are very wrong. What earns money in today's world is going on Big Brother, taking your top off on page three or marrying a footballer. This comment just goes to show how little you know about the industry you purport to love so much. I suggest you do a lot more research and get your facts right before you start criticising others and making personal comments.

[Michelle]

I don't think there's any need for personal comments and arguments here. I would hope we all appreciate that many authors don't earn much money, but also that they do have a choice whether to do it/continue. I also still say that used books are not going to go away, no matter what the arguments.

[Guest fireball]

Adam wrote:

Some advice; let it be and have some faith. Maybe if the author wants sympathy from me they should walk through a new book store and read the prices

 

Adam I'm not impressed, not one bit. It's because of people like our Talisman, that make us superbookwormaoholic, at least me, I've know doubt others here too I should think.

 

Adam, it's true, of sorts, what you said :

People make their choices. They are the ones choosing to work their butts off to get a book published. That is their choice. Not mine.

IT IS your choice, it MAY not be your idea to write, fine, but IT IS your choice to buy books 2nd hand or otherwise, one thing you REALLY ought to get your facts straight and that IS author/authoress DO NOT HAVE A N Y SAY IN PRICE OF THEIR BOOKS; that's the publishers, who charge an arm and a leg (or as good as!).

 

And what the hell has or (as good) a punch drunk boxer worth, what was it?...

Ricky Hatton, a world famous undefeated boxing champ. $20 million a fight. Why? Because he is good.

ONLY GOOD.! Who the FECK is he, never heard of it, sorry "him".! is the 'poor' sod still the full shilling?, or did wind up like Mohamed Ali .

 

I'm in my early 50's (you'll be too some day remember THAT bit) and I'm not made of money I'm reasonably well off, at least I own my apartment, so I'm not owing money to anyone, but I still have to take care of the finances, careful with what I buy, and that's not including buying clothes, food oh and paying for the electricity.! But I maybe better off than you..... just, also I've got Scots blood from my Mother's side (her Dad), which makes me not overly mad with my money, not being frugal either, just moderate , so please don't pull the poor student number on here, 'cause you aint...certainly not THAT poor. Been there, done THAT.

 

You have to understand that new books cost money. Used books are the cheaper option and you can find many great gems. If you dislike used book stores then you must really hate libraries.

I repeat writers female/males have no say in THAT Dept.

 

I didn't know the good lady did not like second hand book shops or libraries, I must have missed it that bit of info.

 

I know exactly where Talisman's coming from, and I wish her, from my heart, well and fair sailing, and my your shadow never grow short.

 

Good on you Talisman. knock 'em dead girl...and you will.

[Icecream]

Adam, you are right. I was going to say something similar, but didn't. It is your choice what you do as a career. It is my choice to stay at home with my children which means I have no money. We are all making what we can out of life, and it is not always possible to buy things new. If people like an author enough then that person will make money, just as with any job you need to be good to make money. Not liking the sale of used books will not stop it. We have already proved that people will always buy them for whatever reason, but I am sure we all understand your position Talisman.

[Freewheeling Andy]

Where I find that second hand books are great (in the same way that some music sharing stuff is great) is that they introduce me to authors or styles that I wouldn't normally spend £8-10 on, but for 50p from Oxfam it's worth giving something a try. And maybe 1 time in 4 I'll follow on and buy full price books by the same author. There is a symbiosis, because although the author is missing out first time, in the end they benefit.

 

The other place second hand books are great is when finding some old books that are out of print or almost impossible to find. As mentioned elsewhere, I like the old short story anthologies of SF from the 50s and 60s, and although the authors are still missing out on royalties in theory, these are books that just aren't even in the biggest Waterstones or Blackwells or Borders.

 

I'm sure that sometimes authors have missed out on royalties when I've been buying second hand, but it's not a completely obvious split.

[Nici]

As for your ridiculous comment that talent earns money - sadly you are very wrong. What earns money in today's world is going on Big Brother, taking your top off on page three or marrying a footballer.

 

Sorry I don't agree with this at all.

 

I would like to point out that a lot of the people on the forum wouldn't have the jobs they do if they didn't have the "talent" that they have, to enable them to do their jobs.

 

But, back to the subject of used books, 90% of my books are used simply because I cannot afford to buy new books.

 

The only time I do get new books is if i'm being impatient and have to have it now lol or if I have money off vouchers.

[Guest fireball]

Nici76 wrote:

The only time I do get new books is if i'm being impatient and have to have it now lol or if I have money off vouchers.

And there's nawt wrong them either. Ever so handy they are .

 

The smell of some second hand bookshops is glorious eh.?! It never ceases to amaze me what people actually 'throw out', there little goldmines are secondhand bookshops.

[supergran71]

My my my quite a little argument going on here and all over nothing really isnt it? I suspect its a little generational as well. ONe of the best things my daughter ever did for me was to introduce me to charity book shops and second hand bookshops. What a lot of fun it is to search through them to see if there is an author you like or one that has been mentioned on BCF whom you would like to try out.

 

Most of the well known authors have had their years of struggle, Maeve Binchy and Mary Wesley to name 2. MW was in her 70s before she succeeded in getting published. I believe JK Rowling was a hard up single mother who came up with the wonderful Harry Potter. I am filled with admiration for their tenacity. So if you have got the right ideas and its something that will catch on, you will get there eventually just keep at it Talisman. Although many of us on here cant afford to keep buying new books, there are plenty of readers out there who can afford them. That is why I think this argument is so much hot air and I hope everyone will just calm down now and accept that we are all different.

[Maureen]

I also buy second hand books. The price I have to pay for a brand new book is ridiculous, and I am not thinking about the author when I take this decision, but about myself. After all I am the consumer in the transaction, and as with every other purchase, I decide on where I spend my money. I also do not stop to think whether the clothes I buy were made by a huge factory in a poor country for a well known clothes chain, and the machine operator was paid below minimum wage, or whether the rice I eat was farmed in China, and the farmer got a ridiculous sum for his toil.

[Heather]

I buy secondhand books form the charity thay I work ing as a volunteer it part of the way that we raise funds to keep going. When I've finished with them I pout them back in the shop so that someone else can get the chance to ny them and I can tell them that they are good if that is the kind of book that they are interest in. I may keep some of the books if I find an author that I really like.

[Echo]

That's actually one thing I just thought of, another thing that is so great about used books. My local Goodwill shop has hundreds of great books, and all the money they earn helps fund their charity. My mom's thrift store, which benefits the Seattle Children's Hospital sells a lot of books, too. I used to be in charge of that area, and thousands of people from the Island donate their unwanted books.

[Guest ii]

Oh my God, there's so much I could comment on in here, but I'll have to hold myself back, I suppose...

 

With all due respect though Adam, and I mean this in the best possible way, until you have written and published a book you don't know how you will feel about these things .... You (or anyone else for that matter) can no more understand how I feel than I can understand how you (or anyone else) feels, for the simple reason that I am not you and you are not me!

 

Gosh! Could you possibly try and sound a little more condecending, please?

 

Writing is like anything in life. If your good you'll get paid. Look at Ricky Hatton, a world famous undefeated boxing champ. $20 million a fight. Why? Because he is good. Even authors like John Grisham get paid huge amounts of money because they are good at what they do. Talent earns money.

 

Exactly! If you're good, you'll sell books, and you'll make money. It's very very simple. Then again, if people opt to not read your books, not buying them, not bringing you money... what can you conclude from that?

 

I am a good writer, would I write a book? Probably not. I don't have the time. I would rather do other things with my life. If you want my sympathy and for me to feel sorry for authors who struggle to get by, sorry not going to happen. People make their choices. They are the ones choosing to work their butts off to get a book published. That is their choice. Not mine. Whether I think it is worth a read is my choice. If those authors love what they do and they are happy with their life then I don't see a problem. Money is not everything. And if they really want to write, but can't find the time or money, then let it go. It is called sacrifice. It is part of life. Some advice; let it be and have some faith.

 

I'm with you there, too, baby-bro. It's all about the choices. And if you really think you can just whip up a bestseller and become the creator of the next Harry Potter, just like that, you're either naive, or downright stupid.

 

Thank for your comments Oblomov, it is good to know that there is at least one person on here who understands where I am coming from and can get their point across without throwing their toys out of their pram, just because they are challenged a bit.

 

As for Adam, I don't know about authors having sympathy for poor students, but if you want me to understand you then quite frankly you should learn some manners. There is no need to make this personal by making comments such as okay I get if, you write books, good for you.

 

Right, 'cause Adam here's the one without manners. You really should reconsider the ever-so-sympathetic oh-I've-been-though-a-lot-in-my-life (which I don't deny, maybe you have, I don't know you) minorities-understanding image you try to create for yourself if you repeatedly make posts like that. They're more than slightly contradicting. Not to mention ridiculous and rude.

 

If it wasn't for the likes of me who yes, make a choice as to whether to do this, then you couldn't be student in the first place, as someone had to write your course material.

 

Frankly, my dear, you're wrong. Most books used in universities are written by academics, who a) get paid well for their publishing and are required to do that as part of their jobs. So don't try to sell your self-importance on issues where you have none.

 

As for your ridiculous comment that talent earns money - sadly you are very wrong. What earns money in today's world is going on Big Brother, taking your top off on page three or marrying a footballer. This comment just goes to show how little you know about the industry you purport to love so much. I suggest you do a lot more research and get your facts right before you start criticising others and making personal comments.

 

Big Brother and Page Three and pretty airheads marrying footballers are marginal cases. And briging them out makes one think only that either you're jealous or only read the tabloids. Talent does earn money. What about the football the airhead married? What about the people who came up with the concept of Big Brother? What about the greators of Google? What about... There are tons and tons of people more than very well off because of their talents. The key is, you can't read about them in the tabloids. They're in The Financial Times and Forbes.

 

Adam I'm not impressed, not one bit. It's because of people like our Talisman, that make us superbookwormaoholic, at least me, I've know doubt others here too I should think.

 

I have zero idea what you're trying to say here. I'm sorry, what??

 

Adam, you are right. I was going to say something similar, but didn't. It is your choice what you do as a career. It is my choice to stay at home with my children which means I have no money. We are all making what we can out of life, and it is not always possible to buy things new. If people like an author enough then that person will make money, just as with any job you need to be good to make money. Not liking the sale of used books will not stop it. We have already proved that people will always buy them for whatever reason, but I am sure we all understand your position Talisman.

 

Thank you for that post, Icecream.

 

On the actual topic of buying second-hand books: I do sometimes get them. For me it's not a money thing, I could afford to buy all my books new if I wanted. However, they rarely make them "the old way" with leather and so on, so the second-hand book stores have been my only hope when trying to find some old classics in Finnish. And lets face it, in my study, not to mention the library room in DD's place, anything but those would look ridiculous. Also, I like the feel of used books, I like it that they've been read and re-read by someone who loved the story.

[Kylie]

it is good to know that there is at least one person on here who understands where I am coming from and can get their point across without throwing their toys out of their pram, just because they are challenged a bit.

 

I think that's a bit unfair Talisman. I'm pretty sure most, if not all, of us have said that we understand where you're coming from, and have then proceeded to put our own points across courteously. Just because we don't agree with everything you say doesn't mean that we are acting like children. For someone who said they didn't want to make a big deal out of this, you are certainly making a big deal out of it! I suggest we drop the argument now and all agree to disagree.

 

I think we're all agreed that there are good and bad points to buying second-hand, both from the author's and publishers point of view and the point of view of the reader. And if we're not all agreed on that, at least we all have our love of books in common don't we? Good, let's be friends

 

What a lot of fun it is to search through them to see if there is an author you like or one that has been mentioned on BCF whom you would like to try out.

 

Most of the well known authors have had their years of struggle, Maeve Binchy and Mary Wesley to name 2.

 

You're right Supergran. I frequently find myself in bookshops these days thinking 'oh, that's what <insert BCF member name> has been reading'.

 

From what I understand, John Kennedy Toole became depressed and later committed suicide after his book was continually rejected by publishers. Then his mother finally got it published 11 years after he died.

 

My local Goodwill shop has hundreds of great books, and all the money they earn helps fund their charity.

 

There are a couple of universities here that hold annual book fairs. They're very popular as the books are dirt cheap and all the money raised goes back into facilities for the students and the university. It's nice to think that my love of reading is helping someone get an education (in some remote, indirect kind of way! )

[beef]

I suppose I shouldn't really say this, as I have bought used books myself in the past (albeit mostly out of print ones), but buying them in this way does the author no favours whatsoever. Most of us are struggling to make ends meet as it is - a recent survey by the Society of Authors found that the majority of their members earn less than

[Adam]

Thank for your comments Oblomov, it is good to know that there is at least one person on here who understands where I am coming from and can get their point across without throwing their toys out of their pram, just because they are challenged a bit.

 

As for Adam, I don't know about authors having sympathy for poor students, but if you want me to understand you then quite frankly you should learn some manners. There is no need to make this personal by making comments such as okay I get if, you write books, good for you. If it wasn't for the likes of me who yes, make a choice as to whether to do this, then you couldn't be student in the first place, as someone had to write your course material.

 

As for your ridiculous comment that talent earns money - sadly you are very wrong. What earns money in today's world is going on Big Brother, taking your top off on page three or marrying a footballer. This comment just goes to show how little you know about the industry you purport to love so much. I suggest you do a lot more research and get your facts right before you start criticising others and making personal comments.

 

LOL, I was never "fighting" with you. I have better things to do with my life then argue on the internet. I come on this site to discuss books. Everyone here is friendly and this forum is a nice little escape after a hard/long day. Lets not clog it up with silly posts or arguments.

 

I respect your view point and understand completely where you are coming from. I understand the realities of the world and how hard it is to publish a book or become a movie star or musical hit. I understand that it is hard to make money. That is why I stand by my statement that talent earns money. If your good and what you do you will get paid. These stories about celebs getting paid to party and such is pop culture news. I am talking about true talent at its purest form. Wayne Gretzky's goals, Muhammad Ali's knockouts, Elvis' number one hits, even the nurse saving a life all have talent and dedication for what they do, and that is why they are good at what they do, and that is why they recieve the money they do. Well except for the nurses, they deserve more money

 

I do not apreciate your comments on me being "callenged" a bit. I was not "throwing" toys. They were not directed towards me per say, but I know who you were talking about. I am not stupid. I was born at night, but not last night.

 

I in no way made this a "personal" affair. I simply laid out my points about my position. I am sorry you could not see my view point.

 

And I also am not a fan of you insulting me by saying I have no manners. I am a well mannered man. I never cussed at you or anything like that, I simply laid out my points. I do tend to say it like it is, but that is just me. I always take pride in my manners and I try to present a positive aura about me. I am sure if you met me in person you would see that I am a gentleman.

 

With that being said I would like to extend my hand and end this silly behavior. I respect your points and would like to move on from this. I am sorry for this. I in no way wanted this to happen.

 

*As for a side note: Ricky Hatton is the eighth richest boxer, I bet you don't want to hear how much the richest makes eh fireball?

[Guest fireball]

Adam wrote :

*As for a side note: Ricky Hatton is the eighth richest boxer, I bet you don't want to hear how much the richest makes eh fireball?

No not really, she/he hopfully warrants it.

[princessponti]

I've just read the title of this thread and it mad me feel sad. Used Books. I imagine them all broken in dark alleyways scraping around in bins for food. Cast aside. No longer wanted. Read once, their words roughly lifted from the page by an aggressive reader and then thown away, never to be picked up again. Never to be savoured, and loved, and cared for; never to know the tenderness of a real book lover.

 

Let us find them and cherish them as if they were our own.

[pontalba]

I've just read the title of this thread and it mad me feel sad. Used Books. I imagine them all broken in dark alleyways scraping around in bins for food. Cast aside. No longer wanted. Read once, their words roughly lifted from the page by an aggressive reader and then thown away, never to be picked up again. Never to be savoured, and loved, and cared for; never to know the tenderness of a real book lover.

 

Let us find them and cherish them as if they were our own.

princessponti,

I love your outlook and take on this subject! :readingtwo:

[Maureen]

and you made me smile!

[Adam]

I've just read the title of this thread and it mad me feel sad. Used Books. I imagine them all broken in dark alleyways scraping around in bins for food. Cast aside. No longer wanted. Read once, their words roughly lifted from the page by an aggressive reader and then thown away, never to be picked up again. Never to be savoured, and loved, and cared for; never to know the tenderness of a real book lover.

 

Let us find them and cherish them as if they were our own.

 

 

LOL, I couldn't agree more. Nice outlook on the whole topic!