pontalba's 2013 reading list

[pontalba]

Great reviews  I'm adding these two to my wish list.

 

Thanks, Ruth!  They're very different, and well worth it.

[pontalba]

Julie, here is the comparative review I found.....I think I posted it here a few years ago, but here 'tis again.  Thought you might find it interesting.

 

 

A Woman In Berlin:  Eight Weeks in the Conquered City by Anonymous
compared to
Gone With the Wind by Margaret Mitchell

Probably a more unlikely comparison cannot be imagined, on first look, and granted it is only certain sections that are applicable in this arena. I wish we knew more of Anonymous, her background and what happened to her after that fateful and terrible eight weeks. We don't, and that is the end of that for now at least. But we do know some of what happened to Scarlett, and she reaped what she sowed to a great extent. Did she overcome her own short-sightedness regarding Rhett? We don't really know as Ms. Mitchell didn't write the sequel and the same applies to Anonymous. We don't know what happened to her after the rift with Gerd, her returned lover. In both cases the romantics among us can only hope that love won out.

"A Woman in Berlin" is a terrible story of the eight weeks surrounding the Fall of Berlin in 1945. This woman, an experienced journalist, recounts with clarity and a certain cold-bloodedness the Hell that was descending on Berlin. Waiting for an army to occupy.....that is one of the first points of comparison. So much that Anonymous recounts is exactly the same as Scarlett waiting for the Northern Army to descend on Atlanta in 1864. The cannons in the distance drawing closer and closer.

From "A Woman in Berlin"....
"The courtyards echo the sound of the gunfire. For the first time I understand the phrase "thunder of cannon", which until now has always sounded like a hollow cliché, such as "courage of a lion" or "manly chest". But thunder is an apt description. Showers and storms outside. I stood in the doorway and watched some soldiers pass by our building, listlessly dragging their feet. Some were limping. Mute, each man to himself, they trudged along, out of step, toward the city. Stubbly chins and sunken cheeks, their backs weighed down with gear.......The only thing they inspire is pity, no hope or expectation. They already look defeated, captured. They stare past us blindly, impassively, as we stand on the curb."

The starvation. At one point Anonymous says...
"My sole concern as I write these lines is my stomach. All thinking and feeling, all wishes and hopes begin with food."

Reading the above reminded me so much of the Confederate soldiers leaving Atlanta just ahead of the Northern Army.....from old men to beardless young boys marching out to try to face the enemy one more time. Hopeless. But still they did it, and died for nothing. This is from GWTW just before Scarlett left Atlanta with Melanie.....

"I must think. But thoughts eluded her, darting in and out of her mind like frightened hummingbirds. As she stood hanging to the sill, a deafening explosion burst on her ears, louder than any cannon she had ever heard. The sky was rent with gigantic flame. Then other explosions. The earth shook and the glass in the panes above her head shivered and came down around her. The world became an inferno of noise and flame and trembling earth as one explosion followed another in ear-splitting succession."

Both women waiting for the enemy to descend. Scrabbling for the barest of essentials. Food. Water. Both enduring the terrors that an invading army of desperate men bring. Anonymous did endure repeated rape and the swift realization of the realities of her situation, choosing to find an officer to keep her and thus prevent the enlisted men from gang raping her. The character of Scarlett also left niceties behind when she went after Rhett to try to get him to marry her...she hated him at that point, but swallowed her pride, chose common sense and went after the richest man she knew to save her family and land.

So really in the end the stories are at their heart more alike than I even realized even though almost a century and an ocean apart. Two women surviving men's war, with their sanity (more or less) intact and able to face the world. The styles are of course vastly different, but the message the same.
 

Edited December 11, 2013 by pontalba

[julie]

Kate

 Thanks for reposting the review ... I'll post my questions again over here so I don't clog up Paul's thread with all my yakking . Is that your husband's thread ?  I thought his name was Charles/ Charlie ? 

  Sorry to sound so ditzy and nosey ...

 

Anyhow, have you read any books about Margaret Mitchell ? I was wondering if  she had a sort of statement to make with the book, telling about how hard it was for the Southerners, especially hard on the plantation owners financially, and losing so many of their boys and men ,it must have been a hideous time . Do you know of many books that were written from the views from the Northerners ?

I know I have probably read some, but none are clicking right now,so will have to do some thinking on it and come back in ..

 

 

Anyhow, were Mitchell's views more CEREBRAL .. in other words, was the War the main thing she wanted to focus on, or did she want to write a romance and center it during the war ?

 

I'll be back in a bit-- going to grab some lunch !

 

Thanks --

[Paul]

Do you know of many books that were written from the views from the Northerners ?

 

 

Hi Julie, Interjecting here my own answer to your question.  Which is: "All of them."

I've lived all of my life up North, as we northerners say, and can say that up there in the Northeast there is no sympathy whatever for the South or for the Northern War of Aggression as many down here in the South would call it.  Slavery is the sole issue that is taught in the schools up there and its end is (correctly) saluted as a correct and major accomplishment.

 

I have been down here for four years now and am seeing the reality which is and was the South.  The War was a total cataclysm for the South.  They were totally destroyed by the war -- the economy totally destroyed; oppressed by the  Government; social structures completely demolished; and loss of political representation in Washington.  The South was defeated, trashed, plundered and punished without second thought, and without a Marshall Plan to assist recovery, and that was and is still regarded as a good thing up where I come from (NYC).

 

I don't wish to reignite the War, but some feelings down here are still strong.  Justifiably IMO.

Edited December 12, 2013 by Paul

[pontalba]

Kate

 Thanks for reposting the review ... I'll post my questions again over here so I don't clog up Paul's thread with all my yakking . Is that your husband's thread ?  I thought his name was Charles/ Charlie ? 

  Sorry to sound so ditzy and nosey ...

 

Anyhow, have you read any books about Margaret Mitchell ? I was wondering if  she had a sort of statement to make with the book, telling about how hard it was for the Southerners, especially hard on the plantation owners financially, and losing so many of their boys and men ,it must have been a hideous time . Do you know of many books that were written from the views from the Northerners ?

I know I have probably read some, but none are clicking right now,so will have to do some thinking on it and come back in ..

 

 

Anyhow, were Mitchell's views more CEREBRAL .. in other words, was the War the main thing she wanted to focus on, or did she want to write a romance and center it during the war ?

 

I'll be back in a bit-- going to grab some lunch !

 

Thanks --

 

Yes, that is my husband's thread.    We registered on BCF back in 2006 way before we were married.  He used to use different names on the various forums.

 And, yes, his name is Charles.  LOL  Not ditzy or nosey! 

 

I actually have a bio of Mitchell, unread.....    But I have skimmed it some.  I believe mostly what she wanted to impart was the broad sweep of history.  You see, she grew up with those veterans of the War, knew them, loved them.  She grew up on their stories, both good and bad.  They were dying out by her time and she wanted to get their stories out there.  To try to make people in the "present" understand more of the lives and losses of the South. 

 

It's so easy for one side to "throw rocks" at the other side and make "them" the bad guys.  There was good and bad on both sides, and wrongs perpetrated from both sides of the fence.  One of my Mother's favorite sayings was "two wrongs don't make a right".  In war, especially, that axiom goes straight out of the window, and it's winner/killer take all.  Everyone suffers.

 

One of the books I am currently reading (on and off) is Citizen Sherman:  A Life of William Tecumseh Sherman by Michael Fellman.  If you read the description of Sherman's March through Georgia, it'd make you cringe.  Utter barbarous cruelty.  Women and children left to literally starve.  Which was what it took to "win" that war.  That methodology was new to the modern warfare of his time.  Sherman had to reach back in history to find that one.

 

Of course slavery was wrong, no question there.   But the North was certainly complicit in the practice. They were no innocents, and that lost them the right to throw stones.  IOW, they were not anyone's moral superior.  But certainly pretended to be that. 

 

/rant over/

 

 

I see Charles has posted, have to see what he said.....

[julie]

Thanks guys -- Pretty cool that I  have Duo-Posts to answer .

 

First of all, sorry I didn't recognize that Charles is/was Paul . I thought I remembered you saying he also registered on here, but didn't remember seeing any posts by someone named Charles. I thought Paul was just some other guy that used to be on here and hadn't been for awhile .

(Can I call him Charlie, or doesn't he like that name ? )

 

Anyhow, first to Charles -

   Yes, I knew you were from up here -- NY (I'm Ohio as you surely know )

I can honestly say that no one here talks much of the Civil War unless asked about it or they like to study history, or such ... but you are right in the fact that the Northerners really don't carry it around with us or maybe don't understand the level of losses down there . We can read lots of books about it, but we don't get the full picture ,maybe . See, we don't have the reminders of  family who lost their homes, money, and everything . I have distant family who fought in the War, but none that I know of who were killed .

I do understand that living down there among people who probably all have family stories of losses due to the war would make it more visible and REAL ...Not sure real is the right word, but I'm sure you get what I mean . If you live amongst people who have the sad history to tell  ,  it would maybe be easier to understand the devastation firsthand ... I guess that's why I read about it, trying to put myself more into that place and understand how it was to have everything (sometimes your entire family foundation ) ripped from you .

I'd certainly not ever make light of it or look at it like it's over, so forget about it . I guess I'm just searching for a way to look at it through the southerner's eyes ,so if I could find books that would teach me the firsthand stories, it might help .

 I'd never preach about the slave issue , I think we can all agree that it was wrong, but I also understand that on the big plantations, they needed help to run them and  work . I actually had family on my dad's side who owned a small number of slaves (8) .

That's really not where I was intending to go with this, whether owning slaves was right or wrong. I think we have all come a long ways from that time and know it would be wrong in today's world, but I understand that it happened back then . 

Thanks for responding . And nice meeting you --- you have a real sweetheart of a wife ,as I'm sure you know .

 

 

 

Kate

 Thanks for explaining more about Mitchell . I really didn't know the reason behind her book, if it was meant to lean on the war and devastation it caused, or just meant to take place during that war. I can certainly understand that some books and stories NEED to be told, Isn't it odd that her and Harper Lee ( just for 2 quick examples) both ended up with one book  ,  of a story that REALLY needed told . It'd be interesting to see the parallels of them to see how much alike they may have been in other ways . Mitchell didn't get to live as long ,though ,so it might be hard to compare them .

 

  I'm sure,,as I told Charles that to see and hear the stories directly from people who suffered the losses , makes it easier to empathize . I can't speak for anyone else but myself, but I would never trivialize it in any way . Sherman was an absolute crazy man . He used tactics that were uncalled for and unnecessary ,and that's stating it mildly . I've never witnessed war firsthand, so I can only imagine that people do things during wars that they would never otherwise do .. I hate wars ... I see nothing good to come from them ,and to me, when the first boy is killed, we have all lost already .

 

You're right , there were people on both sides who did awful things . I don't look at any side as bad guys ... I don't look at either one as winners . It makes me sad to know how so many people down there had their lives destroyed . I guess I am just searching for possibly what you have heard more times than you want to , stories from people who lived there .. I think I could learn a lot by hearing them .

I'm not saying Gone With the Wind wasn't a good book, for me it just didn't hit the mark of the GUTS of the story ,maybe . It seemed to me to talk too much about the romance and such . I think I would have been able to learn more about the firsthand experiences if it were told in a different manner .

 Once again, I go back to Oldest Living Confederate Widow ,mainly because it tells me more of the bare bones , the moms who sent their 14 year old boys off to fight and never saw them again. The wives  who lived with men haunted by the things they witnessed during the war, etc ...

  I just want you to know that I'm not looking at it as a source of entertainment, but more as an interest in knowing what it was like to live on that side of it ... Maybe if I met people who had those stories , saw the buildings left to crumble, it'd teach me what I am looking for . I really do understand that it was awful ,but I don't look at us as the Good guys or the Winners . You guys were never the bad guys ..

It's just a sad time in our history, but as the book I read last night , it shows me both sides ... it lets me see that boys died doing things they really didn't want to do ,all in the name of war .

[pontalba]

  He ordinarily goes by Charles.

And, sheesh!, ya can't remember everything!

 

I really want to get to Oldest Living Confederate Widow.....there is another one on the shelf here, The Widow of the South by Robert Hicks.  Must read as well.   /sigh/

 

We have to look at it, like any other section of history, through the lens of the time.  Looking back with 21st century eyes doesn't cut it.  We cannot apply today's standards to another part of history.  

 

States Rights, IOW, who was going to politically control the country was a huge factor in causing the war.  Think about the many of the Founding Fathers that were Southerners, and held control in the government.  There was a great deal of resentment brewing on account of that.

 

I've got some books from my great grandfather that were contemporaneous views of the time.  I'll take a look-see and find the titles for you. 

Edited December 12, 2013 by pontalba

[julie]

Thanks for looking for some books that might fit the bill .  You're right, it's really hard to look at any event in history and make judgments . If we didn't experience it first hand, it'd be hard to understand.

 I guess that's why I like books so much .

[Paul]

I omitted one thought that only came to me recently (shame on me) since being down here.

The slaves were the owner's capital.  They had been bought, and could be sold again, for cash.

When they were freed, all the owners lost their cash investments with no way to recoup.

Imagine if, up north, everyone's bank books were overnight lifted from them with their entire life savings, and the breadwinner's job gone also, so no source of income.  The economic devastation on the entire country would be enormous, far beyond just the families affected. not to mention the outcry.  The economy would collapse and there would be a massive depression.  That is what happened down here in the course of losing the war.

The war wasn't only settled on the battlefield, and the body count wasn't the only penalty.

In my view it was a cataclysmic disaster for the Country, and a travesty that it couldn't be settled by negotiation and compromise within the Government.  Our legislators just went crazy and went over the edge into the chasm.

 

BTW For some lifelong reason, I'm a Charles, but call me what you will and I'll know who, except not Chuck.

Edited December 12, 2013 by Paul

[julie]

Charlie

 Hope that's ok , I like nicknames ,and if you don't mind I'll choose that name . I wouldn't call you Chuck. I have a cousin named Chuck, so he can use that one .

 

 Yes, I think I can see your point finance- wise for the South . I guess as I said, it's hard to be able to picture the devastation  , living here my whole life and only learning through books. That's why I felt GWTW didn't really hit the mark. So far , Oldest Living Confederate Widow has been EXACTLY the type book that tells me (although fiction, but most likely based on lots of true facts all put together ) what I'm looking for. The actual impact on people ,whether poor or rich, how it impacted all different people . Those are more what I am looking for ..

 

 Thanks for adding to the conversation . Anything to help explain it is appreciated

[Paul]

Charlie is fine.

Not much more to add to Civil War.

Currently partway through: The Fall of the House of Dixie by Bruce Levine.

Edited December 13, 2013 by Paul

[julie]

Charlie  ( & Kate)

 

    Thanks for mentioning the book you are currently reading . I remembered Kate posting it awhile back, either when she bought it or read it , I don't remember which . I do remember looking it up on Amazon at the time , and the beautiful picture on the cover .

   I didn't buy it then, but just now clicked to buy it for my Kindle , since I remembered it before and you just reminded me of it again . Looks interesting  !

[pontalba]

I finished Purge by Sofi Oksanen last night, and am torn between a three and four star rating.  Finally deciding a 3.5/5 was a more fair rating.   

 

Beginning with a page from a hidden notebook, written by "Hans Pekk, son of Eerik, Estonian peasant". These brief notes, written by a seeming prisoner, are scattered though out the book. So, the mystery begins. Who is Pekk, and how did he become the prisoner? What is his fate?

Who is the young woman, far from home that is driven by her own demons, that comes to find the notebook. What is her relationship to Aliide, the protagonist, a woman alone driven by her own demons? If any.

The time frame is quite fluid, skipping back and forth from 1939 to 1992. It is, basically, the tale of a love triangle and it's terrible repercussions. The story is told against the backdrop of WWII and the Reign of Terror of Josef Stalin. It's ending is just after the official dissolution of the Soviet Union.

Battles are not the only way to wage war. The reader gets the sense of the fluid terror that ordinary people were subjected to throughout. Not only that, but the mental and moral adjustments that they made along the way.

Recommended.

Edited December 13, 2013 by pontalba

[julie]

Sounds interesting , Kate  . You should write reviews for a book magazine or newspaper column . You make them ALL sound good .

[Marie H]

I finished Purge by Sofi Oksanen last night, and am torn between a three and four star rating.  Finally deciding a 3.5/5 was a more fair rating.   

 

Beginning with a page from a hidden notebook, written by "Hans Pekk, son of Eerik, Estonian peasant". These brief notes, written by a seeming prisoner, are scattered though out the book. So, the mystery begins. Who is Pekk, and how did he become the prisoner? What is his fate?

 

Who is the young woman, far from home that is driven by her own demons, that comes to find the notebook. What is her relationship to Aliide, the protagonist, a woman alone driven by her own demons? If any.

 

The time frame is quite fluid, skipping back and forth from 1939 to 1992. It is, basically, the tale of a love triangle and it's terrible repercussions. The story is told against the backdrop of WWII and the Reign of Terror of Josef Stalin. It's ending is just after the official dissolution of the Soviet Union.

 

Battles are not the only way to wage war. The reader gets the sense of the fluid terror that ordinary people were subjected to throughout. Not only that, but the mental and moral adjustments that they made along the way.

Beautifully put review!   (and frankie will be very happy too, I think  )

[pontalba]

Sounds interesting , Kate  . You should write reviews for a book magazine or newspaper column . You make them ALL sound good .

 

LOL, thanks Julie.    I can make them sound good, because I don't bother with ones I don't like.  Hardly ever.

 

 

Beautifully put review!   (and frankie will be very happy too, I think  )

 

Thank you, kindly.  

I'm actually wondering how frankie will rate the accuracy.  I believe it is one of those books that can be seen in many lights.

[Kidsmum]

I've added Purge to my wishlist.... great review 

[pontalba]

The Goldfinch isn't what I expected. At all. Donna Tartt writes with an evocative style that puts the reader exactly in the middle of the protagonists life, thoughts, and more importantly, his emotions. His rollercoaster of emotions. Fear, love, loss, confusion, physical trauma, PTSD included are starkly real. I don't believe I've read a more poignant and tender description of the love between a mother and son before.

From the loss by desertion of his father, to the unexpected and violent death of his mother his emotions are ours. Tartt exposes all the nerve endings, ruthlessly. The tension is palpable from the very beginning, never too much, or too little. Always enough to pull the reader along without swamping us. Because, after all, we have to know what happens to the boy.

The author shows us, she doesn't tell us what to think. The reader must, finally come to their own conclusions about the right or wrongness of the situations faced by the boy, and later the man.

Funny, heartbreaking, absolutely lovely.
Recommended.

 

I really look forward to the January selection.......

[julie]

Wow, Kate !

 

You were making me Sweat Bullets        there for a minute ! I just bought this one when it came out and have yet to even read the first sentence. I thought maybe you weren't going to like it ,from the beginning of your review, but read on to find that you really did like it,so that's great!

 

How did it compare to Secret History ? ( Can't remember if you said you had read it or not ? )  I loved that one !

[pontalba]

Wow, Kate !

 

You were making me Sweat Bullets        there for a minute ! I just bought this one when it came out and have yet to even read the first sentence. I thought maybe you weren't going to like it ,from the beginning of your review, but read on to find that you really did like it,so that's great!

 

How did it compare to Secret History ? ( Can't remember if you said you had read it or not ? )  I loved that one !

 

Whoops!  Sorry, Julie!  

 

I haven't read Secret History, it's the January Reading discussion though.  I'll read it for that, and really look forward to it! 

Glad to hear  you liked it so much.  When did you read it?

[julie]

I read Secret History clear back when it first came out in hardback, so it's been several years. I still remember it and liked it a lot . Hope you enjoy it too .

[Little Pixie]

Glad that The Goldfinch is a good read ; I`ve read some very positive reviews, but it`s good to hear from a `real` person.

 

I`ve read her first two books ; shall get round to buying The Goldfinch once it`s cheaper ( I look at my TBR and only allow myself paperback or used hardback treats atm, though how long that`ll last for... ).

 

I don`t know anything about Sherman ( I saw Gone with the Wind at the cinema - no, not when it came out, but in the 80`s  ) but was interested to see he had Tecumseh as a middle name, the Chief who sided with the Brits.  

[Kidsmum]

I can't wait to read The Goldfinch..... hurry up Santa 

[pontalba]

I was fortunate to hit one of those 2.99 USD kindle copy sales.  I'd been interested in it, but not at "new" prices. 

[pontalba]

Little Pixie wrote:  I don`t know anything about Sherman ( I saw Gone with the Wind at the cinema - no, not when it came out, but in the 80`s  ) but was interested to see he had Tecumseh as a middle name, the Chief who sided with the Brits.

 

 

The first I read about Sherman was in A First-Rate Madness: Uncovering the Links Between Leadership and Mental Illness by Nassir Ghaemi.  One of the sections is on Sherman.  Fascinating. I read it last year, put up a brief review here..... http://www.bookclubforum.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/9619-pontalbas-2012-reading-list/page-4?hl= nassir  ghaemi

Edited December 19, 2013 by pontalba