BookJumper

There's a specific reason behind a lot of classics being "too long", i.e. that given the lack of films and video-games, reading used to hold a much larger share of the entertainment market: many 19th century novelists, from Dickens to Hugo, were originally published in serialised form - soap operas, if you like. In any case, I quite enjoy "verbosity" when it uses pretty words to make pithy remarks about the human condition. Les Miserabl

I would never dare presume such a thing . This thread was inspired by my genuine desire to understand the viewpoint of those who don't like poetry one single itsy bit; consuming and producing it are amongst the things that most make me feel alive so I have problems computing the idea that some people don't enjoy any poetry, ever.

Please don't, I fear for your sanity I only managed about three pages and I read (and write!) abstruse words for breakfast! I'd take issue with your statement that you poetry cannot inform. Human affairs (from relationships to politics, from theology to progress) have been following the same patterns for millennia, therefore it seems to me like there is oh so much that can be learnt regarding the way politics work from a variety of historical sources, poetry included. I'm not a great reader of political poetry myself (I'm afraid I'm more the metaphysical sort - please don't hurt me:lurker:) but I'll have a ponder; I'm sure I can come up with something.

Fair enough. Would you deem me a snob if I insisted, and asked you for an example of the many subjects you deem important? The reason I ask is that poetry is something that there is a lot of, and an immense variety in. Therefore, I find it difficult to believe that, given the right piece of poetry that deals with issues which are of interest to you, you would remain unmoved. Should I fail, rest assured I'll allow you to be as disinterested in poetry as you wish .

Thank you, my point precisely. I've spent the summer staring at three Shakespearean sonnets and willing them to surrender their secrets to me, yet it's not like they don't have a surface level one can interact with instinctually.

I did not remember the name of the chunky (not to mention neon pink) book; however, that's what dissertation bibliographies are for . It is: Horst Schroeder, Additions and Corrections to Richard Ellmann

@ Anika: First of all, shame on those teachers who instead of inspiring their students, bore them to death. Englis Lit classes can be brilliant - together with Philosophy they were the only thing that kept me from quitting school at 16 - so it saddens me when they're not . As for what you should be reading, I'd need a bit more info to get the cogs working on that. I find that the themes that interest me in prose interest me in poetry, so if you could give me an idea of your favourite classic novels and ideas you like to read about, I'll gladly put my expertise at your service . @ Jay: I'd disagree that poetry is all about over-analysis. To my mind, a poem which doesn't mean anything except after hours of excruciating labour is not a particularly good poem. Of course, poetry is infinitely layered and if you so wished, you could spend weeks, months and years working it out - but the point is that even the poems you could analyse all your lifetime to get to the bottom of, usually have something quite immediate to say. Take Shakespeare's Sonnet 116, for instance, my very own favourite poem: Let me not to the marriage of true minds Admit impediments; love is not love Which alters when it alteration finds, Or bends with the remover to remove: O, no, it is an ever-fix

Yes, yes, yes and yes; I completely, utterly, 100% agree. My favourite contemporary authors are in fact those who still demonstrate a measure of love and respect for language, and don't think that just because a work is in prose it can't be poetical. "Old-fashioned" is a compliment in my book.

I agree entirely; so did good old Desiderius Erasmus of Rotterdam, who said, "When I get a little money I buy books; and if any is left I buy food and clothes" - see? We're in eminent company.

Not to worry, it did thrill and chill me - isn't that why one reads gothic literature? I didn't think it necessary to remark on it because it seems obvious to me that a good gothic novel will elicit scaredness.

I find memorising a piece the only way to avoid embarassment when declaiming it (I'll stutter if I read; I won't if I know the thing off by heart), but - here comes the tricky part - unless I've already understood it and assimilated it into my very soul, it will not stick in my memory. Some things I know by heart (the first that spring to mind, I'm sure there's more): - Too many bits of Shakespeare to mention, including but not restricted to sonnets 55, 107, 116, 123* - Too many bits of Jane Austen's Pride and Prejudice to mention - Random bits of Dante's Inferno - The incipit of Monti's Italian verse translation of Homer's Iliad - Walt Whitman's O Captain, My Captain * interestingly, the way I learnt sonnets 55, 107 and 123 was spending the entire summer translating them over and over again - now that's a way to engage and experience literature! You never know what layers of meaning may be eluding you unless you stare at a piece of writing for weeks on end, wondering just how to render "And dwell in lovers' eyes" in another language. A seemingly innocent, easy line... or is it?

Alas I barely eat out at all, partly because I'm destitute and partly because my favourite chains from back in Liverpool don't exist in London ! They were: Eddie Rockets - because you can't go wrong with huge hamburgers prepared to order, milk shakes/floats made with proper ice-cream, red leather booths and real juke-boxes at every table playing awesome tunes from the '50s and '60s for a very reasonable 20p. The staff is brilliant to too; I could ask them for a "Cheeez Please with Swiss cheese, hold all veggies and pickle, extra bacon, and some mayonnaise on the side" and they'd never get it wrong - bless them. The Tavern Co. - this Mexican chain makes THE best sticky ribs in the whole wide world (well, after my mum's), presented in a huge mound suitable for sharing when your OH is just as much of a carnivore as you are. The place is also single-handedly responsible for introducing me and getting me addicted to halloumi cheese, which I bear them eternal gratitude for.

Mmm... nom nom nom.

[Please forgive the obnoxious, spoil-sporting English Lit graduate she can't help it]: It is also full of errors, apparently; while writing my dissertation I even came across a (fairly chunky) book which listed and set straight each of Ellmann's errors in page order...!

I'd disagree - contemporariness doesn't make a book bad or unquotable. Excessive popularity (viz. Brown, Meyer et a.), possibly; but there are contemporary writers deserving of remembrance. Whether or not they attain it is, of course, another matter entirely. I must admit that I find his ideas interesting, though I don't subscribe to them; I just wish he'd been a better writer and not so excruciatingly dull.

Not really. The only ones that have ever gotten soggy are those that have taken a dip into the bath (not a common occurrence in our household), however books that one takes into the bath are not usually from the bathroom shelf but rather the ones that are being read at the time. Books on the bathroom shelf are for, ah, other endeavours !

It's ok, it's a good kind of trauma, i.e. if it hadn't been a good film I wouldn't have cried like a baby. This sounds brilliant; need to get hold of it methinks. I've never dared watch number two, the first one is one of my favourite films - ok, it's daft but in a goodhearted way, the message is lovely and the whole film endlessly quoteable. Watched Short Circuit tonight; it's such an awwww film (and Wall-E, lovely as it is, is such a rip-off)!

This pretty much sums up my own Brownian experience, although even the comedy badness couldn't persuade me to finish The Da Vinci Code *shudder*. You would have enjoyed the John Connelly/Mark Billingham talk & signing I attended recently; it quickly turned into a dig-at-Brown-fest, it was marvellous !

As a part-Italian born and raised in Italy, I miss the food so much. My mum's homemade pesto/blog sauce are to die for (she's a Brit but cooks better Italian food than a lot of Italians mums I know), and as for my nan's lasagne... mmm! Forget (ugh) Dolmio and give me mozzarella that doesn't bounce off walls, non-vegeterian parmesan (oh, the abomination)!, give me marrow-full T-bone steaks over a bed of saffron rice, give me Neapolitan pizza topped with basil leaves the size of a quarter-slice, give me Amatriciana bucatini showered with smoked bacon pieces and salted sheep's cheese, give me a whole pig's knee on the bone and pumpkin ravioli and pears with cheese...!!! *swoons* Compared to the above, I find English food a little unvaried, however when well made it's homey and comforting and tasty. Shepherd's pie, steak & ale pie, bangers and mash, Sunday roast... - made with love from quality ingredients they can be so nice. Polish food I also love, which is unsurprising given that blood-wise I'm more Polish than I am Italian or British. Cottage cheese and caramelised onion pieroghi (oversized ravioli), beetroot soup (I don't even like beetroot! so go figure), mounds of cooked meat for breakfast... now that's my kind of food. I also adore japanese, both sushi and noodle-based (why oh why oh why is it that in England restaurants that do one rarely do the other?), although I'll only eat salmon if it's cooked in rice vinegar; chinese in nigh on all its manifestations, curry (this needs to be mild; give me a honey/pasanda/butter/delight/kashmir dish, a peshwari naan, some panir cheese and a glass of mango lassi and I'm happy)... I don't think I've ever tried a cuisine I didn't like at all, to be honest. Germans and Austrians have the best sausages and beer in the world; the Hugarians make the best fried cheese ever; the Spanish have cured meat platters to die for; the Greeks rock with their overflowing kebabs, lovely dips and iced coffees; I could go on.

Picked up Generation Dead again yesterday in a bid to be good and finish books before starting new ones; it will be interesting to compare this to Handling The Undead when I get to it, as the story is near identical but geared towards different audiences.

I met someone yesterday at a fiction writing workshop yesterday who doesn't read fiction as he regards it a waste of time... hypocritical or what ?

Yesterday I received Alan Bennet's The Uncommon Reader from BookMooch; meant to be in excellent condition, it was water damaged; the packaging was dry and intact so it did not happen in transit. Instead of leaving negative feedback (I've stopped doing that since I was last viciously insulted for being "ungrateful", I don't like confrontation much), I emailed the giver to express my concerns and I was insulted yet again. I don't deserve this. Not all collectors are minted, some of us have to resort to the used book trade and rely on people's honesty re: books being in the condition they say they are. What's this about not even having the right to be -ed off when we've clearly been lied to? Joining has made me

The Abyss - long and took a bit to get going but once it got going, it really got going! It's sheer emotional genius, I blubbered so much, boy, am I traumatised! It made Armageddon look positively mirthful.

I haven't read anything since I finished Biblioholism due to an impending deadline which I met (barely) at 8pm today; I've earned the time to read now but I'm still trying to decide what...