Ruth

I actually found myself wondering what circles Norah Vincent moved in!! She seemed very very cynical of people in general!

No problem Charmer, the chapters are the other way around in my edition. Re the dating chapter...I was surprised that so many of the women wanted to see her when she revealed her real identity. I think I'd be annoyed to know that someone had deliberately duped me for their own experiment! Also, some of the women she dated sounded, frankly, horrible. I think I' have made my excuses and left after an hour of some of their rudeness. I would say that there probably are some men who are ashamed of themselves for going into sex clubs, but certainly not all of them. As for the women enjoying it - I can't say, but I suspect that for a lot of women it is a last desperate resort. Whether or not they enjoy it, even just reading about it made me feel dirty. What consenting adults do with each other is no business of mine, as long as they're not hurting anyone else, but the whole thing just seemed so seedy and miserable. VF made a good point - the chapter opens wtih a man making some very derogatory comnments about women. In my experience, I don't think most men think like that. Yes, they may say things like that to other men as a joke, or for shock value - but I don't think that man was representative of men in general.

Interesting - in my book (Kindle version) chapter 3 was the sex club and chapter 4 was the dating. I even checked before posting today. Might be some differences in the ebook maybe? (not in the content, but in the layout?) Will be back on later to post in a bit more depth.

Okay, I'll go ahead - there may be spoilers below I wasn't bothered by all the situations, but I thought infiltrating the monastery was very disrespectful (I say this as a person who isn't religious). I can't help thinking that if the situation was reversed - say a man had disguised himself as a woman to infiltrate a nunnery - there would have been uproar. Also, the last chapter (I'm going to spoiler this for anyone who hasn't read this far) : Despite all that, the book did make for interesting reading, and I thought it flowed well. I'm not meaning to criticise or even to suggest that I didn't enjoy it - just that I had some reservations. Anyway I digress and I apologise for that! Regarding chapter 3 - where Ned went undercover at sex clubs. Personally I found this whole chapter a bit depressing. I guess it was just the seediness of it all. I'm not sure that Ned established anything other than what I would have expected - women are objectified in such places; pretty obvious really. However, some of the men in the chapter honestly seemed pretty pathetic, and the whole part with the women giving oral sex on stage (even though it was only simulated) was uncomfortable reading. Not that I wasn't aware that such things went on, but I gues it's not something I've given much thought to in the past. Incidentally, I had no problems with Norah's disguise in this environment, where people are just seen as objects rather than people anyway. In this kind of situation, I guess she had no option but to go disguised as a man - after all, what kind of reception would she have received as a woman in such a place?

I've finished this book now, and hmmm....I have real questions about the ethics of what she did, to be honest. Looking forward to discussing it though

Have finished reading Self-Made Man, by Norah Vincent, but am not going to post my review on here yet, as I know other people are currently reading this book. I found parts of it interesting, but would seriously question the ethics of what Norah did. I ended up not particularly liking the author, although I have to admire the extent to which she went in order to make herself convincing as a male. Started reading The Legend of Colton H. Bryant, by Alexandra Fuller - a fictionalised account of the true life of a young man from Wyoming. So far I am liking it a lot - the writing is beautiful, almost poetic at times.

this made me laugh. I can just imagine them inside, arms crossed - "NO! We will NOT remove the apostrophe!"

Yes I have that problem sometimes, but I find it's usually more to do with distractions around me than what I'm reading. Or if I'm really tired, it can feel like nothing I'm reading is actually going in.

Thanks muggle not It is indeed Gene Kelly with Debbie Reynolds. Singin' In The Rain is my very favourite film ever. It is just such a happy film, and I never get bored of watching it! I love old classic Hollywood - most of my favourite films are from the 1930s - 1950s, and most of my favourites actors too!

Vertigo, with James Stewart. Good twist, which I am obligated not to reveal here, because it would really spoil it for anyone who has never seen the film. I find Hitchcock a bit hit-and-miss generally, but I quite liked this one. (Having said that, NOrth by Northwest and To Catch a Thief are both BRILLIANT films!)

I found myself veering between annoyance and grudging respect for Scarlett She's certainly an interesting character! Hope you enjoy the rest of the book. But if you're enjoying it so far, I think you'll like the rest of it too. Actually I feel like reading it again now

As a recent convert to Shakespeare, I found this book invaluable. I used to think Shakespeare was stuffy, boring and confusing. Ben Crystal LOVES Shakespeare; that much is evident from the way he writes about him in this book – but that wasn’t always the case – and to me, that made me feel confident about this book. I’m am still in the early stages of discovering the beauty of Shakespeare’s work, and I can honestly say that if I had had this book when I was at school, I probably would have discovered the beauty of it years ago! Shakespeare on Toast is sort of like a key to unlocking the Bard’s work. As Crystal acknowledges, you don’t have to really analyse or study Shakespeare to enjoy his plays (or his sonnets, although this book concentrates more on the plays), but a bit of background knowledge and understanding will really enhance your enjoyment. Crystal states clearly that his book is not a full guide to Shakespeare, nor is it intended to be, but it will provide you with all the tools you need to understand his plays a bit better, and thus get more out of them. For example, the way Shakespeare uses ‘thou’ and ‘you’ to different effect; this had never occurred to me before, but once pointed out, the way in which he used these words, and his intention in doing so, become clear. There is also a section of the book devoted to the dreaded iambic pentameter, the form of verse in which most of Shakespeare’s work is written. When I studied poetry, I LOATHED iambic pentameter – or rather, I loathed trying to get to grips with it. However, here it is laid out plainly, and it suddenly became clear to me. The book is written in a chatty, laid back style, and as one of the quotes on the back says, it’s like going to the theatre with a knowledgeable friend. I would strongly recommend anyone with a even a passing interest in Shakespeare to read this book. Terrific!

^^Oh my, I can't believe I left out The Shield's 'Family Meeting'. That was an incredible piece of television.

I recognise myself completely in this post. I didn't know why Waterstone's (I'm still using the apostrophe!) decided to do away with the correct grammar!! I felt the same about The Sisters Brothers as well - I assumed it was about some sisters and their brothers, and immediately thought that there was an apostrophe missing! It's supposed to be a brilliant book - I've heard so many good things about it, and am sorely tempted to get it, but I am really really really trying not to buy any too many books at the moment!

I love this book Hope you enjoy it as much as I did.

Yes, I loved Life On Mars, but ended up just preferring Ashes to Ashes. It was a bit lighter in tone, I think. Agree about Sherlock as well

The first thing I thought when reading the synopsis was - "she's running away from Long Island and she goes to New York???!!! How about running a birt further?! it's always a shame when a book disappoints - especially when it's by an author you've previously enjoyed.

I have this on my tbr - because I spotted the hardback for £3, which seemed like a bargain. I read The Sixth Wife, about Catherine Parr. I thought it was a light and easy read, also with historical inaccuracies (which I can forgive), but the problem was that the speech and language just seemed far too modern for the time in which it was set. Not that I expect the characters to go round calling each other thou or anything like that, but it seemed slightly jarring. Still, I bought The Confession of Katharine Howard after reading The Sixth Wife, so I must have enjoyed it! The Stepford Wives is a terrific book (and the first film version is good too). I have A Kiss Before Dying on my tbr, and am tempted by The Boys From Brazil. This has reminded me that I've been meaning to read The Gunslinger for AGES. It's sitting there on my shelf, looking at me reproachfully. Must get to it soon!

Law & Order Mushrooms (season 1). A shoot out results in the death of an innocent child. Top notch acting all round, with so much emotion. Homicide: Life on the Street Crosetti (season 3) - where one of the regular characters dies. Won't give any more than that away in case anyone watches it, but it's possibly the most powerful hour of television which I have ever seen Ashes to Ashes Final episode. Perfect ending to a perfect series. The Wire Almost any episode. Seriously.

I have Murder at Mansfield Park on my tbr. Have been VERY tempted by Tom-All-Alone's. I've read Bleak House, but not The Woman in White. However, I do have TWIW on my tbr as well, so I might try to read that one before T-A-A's.

VodkaFan, that was a very interesting post - I enjoyed reading it and seeing things from a man's perspective. I do think that's quite relevant to the book actually, because no matter how much she looked like a man and entered a man's world, Norah was not a man, and did not want to be one. Re the handshake. I've noticed this with men - very close male friends might give each a man hug; acquaintances won't (but then again, I wouldn't hug a woman who I wasn't close with either), but it seems to me that upon meeting one another, men always seem to shake hands, even in an informal social setting. It's a kind of ritual I guess. (And I'll be working on my own handshake, having taken your comments on board!) To be honest, I'm never sure about women shaking hands with other women. The other week for instance we had to take our dog to the vet, and after we had finished talking to her, my husband shook her hand. I wasn't sure whether to do the same, and I saw her arm twitch and realised that she wasn't sure whether to or not either. I ended up thanking her profusely for making our dog better, and she rubbed my arm! Anyway, I digress... In my experience, unlike men, women DO discuss their husbands/partners and their sex lives with their friends. I have never been comfortable with this, and will never discuss it. It's private, it's nobody else's business, and that's the way I like it I was surprised in chapter 2 at how well the other men on Ned's team took it when they found out the truth. I'm not sure how I'd feel if I'd become friends with someone and then found out that they had been effectively lying to me throughout the entire friendship. I'm not sure if their response was typical of most people's responses. No doubt there is truth in what she and you said about men's reticence. Generally I think women talk a lot more than men (not wishing to generalise though). VF, I found what you said about the men's locker room very interesting. When I was at school, I HATED getting changed in front of the other girls. I think it was because I didn't have much body confidence then. I go to a gym now, and to be honest, it no longer bothers me. I still prefer getting changed when there's no-one else there, but I don't worry if there are others there. And I can understand what your dad meant with his advice! Overall, I really enjoyed chapter 2. It did give a bit of insight into how men are together - or at least how THOSE men were together - and it made for pleasant reading. Chapter 3 made me uncomfortable, but I'm sure we'll get to that later...

It's my aunt's favourite book and she has told me to read it goodness knows how many times. I do have a copy, and hope to get to it at some point in the not-too-distant future!

Ooh yes, I second the suggestion for The Time Machine. Terrific book I think I read it in one sitting, and now I want to read it again

I loved Persuasion (but then again I love most Austen books). I like the sound of Captain Wentworth's diary, as I do love books which tell the same story from different points of view. I found Mr Darcy's Diary the other day in a charity shop (I forget who the author is), which is basically telling Pride and Prejudice from Darcy's point of view. It's had some good reviews ( ) so hopefully will be quite enjoyable. I do agree with Poppy's point though - the problem with a lot of sequels written by different authors is that the characters are so different to how they appear in the original works. I actually have Scarlett, which is the sequel to Gone With The Wind, at home, and keep eyeing it up on my bookshelf, but am wary about reading it, in case it changes the characters of Rhett and Scarlett.

Read some more of Self Made Man yesterday, and am absolutely loving Shakespeare on Toast