Mac Posted March 10, 2010 Share Posted March 10, 2010 Crumbs, Frankie. You've got some good ones there! I often wish that I had learned another language to the point where I could read a novel in it's original form. I'm awash with admiration for you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frankie Posted March 10, 2010 Author Share Posted March 10, 2010 (edited) Crumbs, Frankie. You've got some good ones there! I often wish that I had learned another language to the point where I could read a novel in it's original form. I'm awash with admiration for you. Well, if it's any consolation, English is 'forced' upon us in the third grade of elementary school (when kids are about 8-9 years old) so we do start at a very early age. And if it hadn't been obligatory, I don't know if I'd had such common sense to choose to study it myself. Besides, it's never too late to learn a new language. Especially at such a young and vibrant stage where you are now Also, you do get to read an amazing load of texts in their original language: a massive proportion of the world's writers are English speaking! Edited March 10, 2010 by frankie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peacefield Posted March 10, 2010 Share Posted March 10, 2010 Most excellent haul, Frankie! I approve . I too wish I had learned another language or two. Although Sheldon from TBBT didn't make learning Finnish look too hard! Oh wait, he's a partical physicist... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frankie Posted March 10, 2010 Author Share Posted March 10, 2010 Most excellent haul, Frankie! I approve . I too wish I had learned another language or two. Although Sheldon from TBBT didn't make learning Finnish look too hard! Oh wait, he's a partical physicist... Maybe Sheldon would be up for giving you some private lessons? I don't think it would be very wise to learn Finnish in order to read great literature in Finnish though, I don't think we have that many world wide famous classics. I wouldn't even know what to recommend. Oh I'd recommend Sofi Oksanen, she's a relatively new author but the thing is she's got partly Estonian roots and a lot of her books has to deal with Estonia's current situation and the history, so she doesn't say that much about Finland. Good stuff though. The minute her latest novel Puhdistus is translated into English I'm gonna harass you people to read the book Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peacefield Posted March 10, 2010 Share Posted March 10, 2010 Yes! Private lessons would be good, I like that idea . Well, maybe I should start with French or Italian, hmmm? Although Oksanen sounds intriguing, Frankie! Please let us know when that book is translated to English . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frankie Posted March 10, 2010 Author Share Posted March 10, 2010 (edited) Yes! Private lessons would be good, I like that idea . Well, maybe I should start with French or Italian, hmmm? Although Oksanen sounds intriguing, Frankie! Please let us know when that book is translated to English . I was also thinking maybe French, Italian or Spanish. Such classics they have... Sofi Oksanen is indeed intriguing! Before I'd read any of her books, I thought she was a real weirdo and I had so many prejudices against her, just by looking at her. She has this goth style that sticks out like a sore thumb. And she was really opinionated. Then a friend of mine took a chance and read one of her books and made me read it too and I realised I'd been shallow and stupid to judge her so easily without even having read any of her books. She's written 3 so far, she likes to write in this autofictional way (she's dealt with for example bulimia and social anxieties). Each book is better than the previous one and her latest was simply fantastic! *rant rant positive rant* Edit: Woooot! Amazon.com says Purge by Sofi Oksanen, pre-order now! (coming out on April 1st?) From amazon.com: Soon to be published in twenty-five languages, Sofi Oksanen’s award-winning novel Purge is a breathtakingly suspenseful tale of two women dogged by their own shameful pasts and the dark, unspoken history that binds them. When Aliide Truu, an older woman living alone in the Estonian countryside, finds a disheveled girl huddled in her front yard, she suppresses her misgivings and offers her shelter. Zara is a young sex-trafficking victim on the run from her captors, but a photo she carries with her soon makes it clear that her arrival at Aliide’s home is no coincidence. Survivors both, Aliide and Zara engage in a complex arithmetic of suspicion and revelation to distill each other’s motives; gradually, their stories emerge, the culmination of a tragic family drama of rivalry, lust, and loss that played out during the worst years of Estonia’s Soviet occupation. Sofi Oksanen establishes herself as one the most important voices of her generation with this intricately woven tale, whose stakes are almost unbearably high from the first page to the last. Purge is a fiercely compelling and damning novel about the corrosive effects of shame, and of life in a time and place where to survive is to be implicated. Edited March 10, 2010 by frankie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaraPepparkaka Posted March 10, 2010 Share Posted March 10, 2010 Hmm, I haven't read anything by Sofi Oksanen yet. AND I wouldn't have to wait for the translation either.. and there it goes on to the wishlist. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frankie Posted March 10, 2010 Author Share Posted March 10, 2010 (edited) Hmm, I haven't read anything by Sofi Oksanen yet. AND I wouldn't have to wait for the translation either.. and there it goes on to the wishlist. Excellent! Although I think that Puhdistus, or Utrensning, is easily the best novel, I would suggest you start with Oksanen's first novel Stalinin lehm Edited March 10, 2010 by frankie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kylie Posted March 10, 2010 Share Posted March 10, 2010 Joseph Heller: Catch-22 Oscar Wilde: The Picture of Dorian Gray Yay! A couple of my favourite books. And I several more on my TBR pile. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nollaig Posted March 10, 2010 Share Posted March 10, 2010 YAY Picture Of Dorian Gray. Is that on the Rory list or is that just on the Frankie list? I might read it with you anyway when you get to it - any excuse! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frankie Posted March 10, 2010 Author Share Posted March 10, 2010 Yay! A couple of my favourite books. And I several more on my TBR pile. I thought you'd be particularly intrigued by The Neon Bible, I know I am YAY Picture Of Dorian Gray. Is that on the Rory list or is that just on the Frankie list? I might read it with you anyway when you get to it - any excuse! That's actually on the 1001 Books -list, Rory list and Frankie wanna read -list I have no idea when I'll get around to actually reading it, I've borrowed it from the library like 5 times and I've never managed to read it yet Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kylie Posted March 10, 2010 Share Posted March 10, 2010 I definitely want to get a hold of The Neon Bible one day. Until then, I will anxiously await your review! How long do you get to borrow all these books for? Will you get through them all in time? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nollaig Posted March 10, 2010 Share Posted March 10, 2010 What on Earth is The Neon Bible?! I like the name Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frankie Posted March 11, 2010 Author Share Posted March 11, 2010 I definitely want to get a hold of The Neon Bible one day. Until then, I will anxiously await your review! How long do you get to borrow all these books for? Will you get through them all in time? All of the books have a month's time. The uni library ones I can re-borrow (unless the books have been reserved by some other person) for a year (!!), the town library ones I can re-borrow five times. There's no saying I'll get to read all of them but I so want to, and I totally must! I'm sure I'd never get through them in one month though. (yes I'm awful when it comes to library books, I'll borrow loads, then won't have time to read all of them and take them back. And immediately borrow loads of other books. It's compensation for not having money to buy books, in a way. I guess ) What on Earth is The Neon Bible?! I like the name The Neon Bible, well I have no idea what it's about, but it's a novel by John Kennedy Toole! He wrote The Confederacy of Dunces (which happens to be on the Rory List, which is why I read it myself, I'm not sure if for example Kylie read it for other purposes as well) which is quite a unique novel to say the least You might want to wiki John Kennedy Toole, he didn't exactly have the most amazing career in writing Started reading the Finnish version of Wuthering Heights last night, the translation is awful and I cannot continue this way, must switch back to English as soon as I reach the point where I was at earlier. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AbielleRose Posted March 11, 2010 Share Posted March 11, 2010 Started reading the Finnish version of Wuthering Heights last night, the translation is awful and I cannot continue this way, must switch back to English as soon as I reach the point where I was at earlier. Thats too bad, frankie. Do you end up reading a lot of books in English because the translation is bad like that? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frankie Posted March 11, 2010 Author Share Posted March 11, 2010 (edited) Thats too bad, frankie. Do you end up reading a lot of books in English because the translation is bad like that? Well normally I always read English books in English if I can only find a copy and if not, I read in Finnish. Basically I try to read as much in English as possible. Usually Finnish translations are okay, good or really good (for example the Harry Potter translations are superb and I love reading the books both in English and in Finnish and I actually own the books in both languages ) but sometimes not so much. The Wuthering Heights translation is really appalling after having read some of the novel in English. There are some tiny details which to me seem like totally misrepresented in the Finnish version. If I'd started the book in Finnish I think it wouldn't be that bad though. If a book is really long, I might prefer to read it in Finnish so it won't take me so long to read it. For example, I read Gone with the Wind in Finnish and the translation was just fine For some reason Stephen King is one of the names that comes to mind when it comes to really poor Finnish translations. The Stand translation was the worst, I actually started writing down some of the slips For example, you guys know 'baby doll pyjamas'? Well, the Finnish translation read exactly that, 'baby' 'doll' 'pyjamas' (in Finnish of course). Imagine a pyjamas with a baby and a doll. Oh man I need to read that book again Edited March 11, 2010 by frankie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frankie Posted March 11, 2010 Author Share Posted March 11, 2010 OMG, Helter Skelter is on telly tonight, must record it but not watch it until I've read the book. It's already giving me the creeps! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AbielleRose Posted March 11, 2010 Share Posted March 11, 2010 (edited) Wow, Finnish sounds complicated! I know in a lot of languages it doesn't matter what order the words are in, they will still mean the same thing. Like in Russian 'I love you' is 'ya tebya lyublyu' but you could actually say 'lyublyu ya tebya' 'tebya ya lyublyu' or any mash up of those 3 words and it would still mean the same thing and be proper. Weird, eh? Whenever I hear 'Helter Skelter' I think of the song. Hmm... Edited March 11, 2010 by CaliLily Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kylie Posted March 11, 2010 Share Posted March 11, 2010 (yes I'm awful when it comes to library books, I'll borrow loads, then won't have time to read all of them and take them back. And immediately borrow loads of other books. I think I would find it frustrating not being able to read them all in time! The Neon Bible, well I have no idea what it's about, but it's a novel by John Kennedy Toole! He wrote The Confederacy of Dunces (which happens to be on the Rory List, which is why I read it myself, I'm not sure if for example Kylie read it for other purposes as well) which is quite a unique novel to say the least You might want to wiki John Kennedy Toole, he didn't exactly have the most amazing career in writing I can't remember where I originally heard about the book, but I don't recall reading it for any challenges. It is indeed a pretty interesting read. I think the author's story is so sad. Another tragic waste. Started reading the Finnish version of Wuthering Heights last night, the translation is awful and I cannot continue this way, must switch back to English as soon as I reach the point where I was at earlier. That's such a shame. How can you pick a bad translation? Is is just because of things like 'baby doll pyjamas', or does it just end up being badly written? OMG, Helter Skelter is on telly tonight, must record it but not watch it until I've read the book. It's already giving me the creeps! Ooh, I don't know if I'd ever be able to watch that. I think the book will be scary enough! Whenever I hear 'Helter Skelter' I think of the song. Hmm... Me too! It's a pretty crazy song. You should listen to it while you read the book, Frankie. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frankie Posted March 11, 2010 Author Share Posted March 11, 2010 (edited) Wow, Finnish sounds complicated! I'm not quite sure how you got that idea from my previous post? Not that Finnish isn't a complicated language to learn, but I was merely pointing out some errors in translations, or rather just the one that I've always found funny as heck! Maybe I explained it poorly. I mean, a baby doll pyjamas (or maybe a baby doll nightgown, it doesn't really make a difference) is just a term for the style of the outfit, the pieces of clothing don't actually have anything to do with a baby or a doll. And the Finnish translation was the Finnish equivalents of 'baby', 'doll' and 'pyjamas' put together as one word. Whenever I hear 'Helter Skelter' I think of the song. Hmm... That's so weird to me, I don't even know that song and it always takes me ages to realise that no you're not talking about some Manson song but a Beatles song I think I would find it frustrating not being able to read them all in time! Quite true, but I'm usually too busy to hunt down other books to borrow and read (or to put in the closet to be read). I can't remember where I originally heard about the book, but I don't recall reading it for any challenges. It is indeed a pretty interesting read. I think the author's story is so sad. Another tragic waste. When Nollaig asked me about The Neon Bible I wikied Toole and noticed that there's actually a biography of him called Ignatius Rising: The Life of John Kennedy Toole. It sounded intriguing, it's going on my wishlist. That's such a shame. How can you pick a bad translation? Is is just because of things like 'baby doll pyjamas', or does it just end up being badly written? Things like 'baby doll pyjamas' are really, really rare, that was definitely the worst translation I've ever come across with and it was so bad it was corny and I wouldn't have changed it for another edition for the world. I was upset for King's sake but I got too much fun out of it. For me, noticing a bad translation begins when you realise that you're actually thinking about the translation rather than going with the plot and the flow of the book. A really good translation does not make you think about the translation itself for one minute. In my opinion, you know you've got a bad translation on your hands when you start noticing the phrases and know exactly what the English version says, and the translator has translated that straight into Finnish without bothering to think if the phrase sounds Finnish at all. I wish I could remember an example for you guys. Edited March 11, 2010 by frankie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kylie Posted March 11, 2010 Share Posted March 11, 2010 Thanks for the clarification I don't think I've ever noticed translation issues with books such as The Count of Monte Cristo and Crime and Punishment. I guess they must be really good translations, which doesn't surprise me as they're such well-known classics that they'd be sure to get it right I guess. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frankie Posted March 12, 2010 Author Share Posted March 12, 2010 Thanks for the clarification I don't think I've ever noticed translation issues with books such as The Count of Monte Cristo and Crime and Punishment. I guess they must be really good translations, which doesn't surprise me as they're such well-known classics that they'd be sure to get it right I guess. Yes, that usually does it Another translational issue that came to mind is the Discworld series by Terry Pratchett. He plays with words so much and so cunningly that it's just impossible to get everything translated, which is why I'll never even try and read the books in Finnish. It's certainly not the translator's fault; it just simply cannot be done. Sure there are translations but it's not the same. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BookJumper Posted March 12, 2010 Share Posted March 12, 2010 Agreed. I've got friends back at home who say they never 'got' Pratchett; I told them that if they read him in Italian they couldn't possibly get him, as he's nigh on untranslatable.* *even I blanch at the prospect, and I've translated Shakespeare! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shin Posted March 14, 2010 Share Posted March 14, 2010 (yes I'm awful when it comes to library books, I'll borrow loads, then won't have time to read all of them and take them back. And immediately borrow loads of other books. It's compensation for not having money to buy books, in a way. I guess ) You are not alone there frankie, I do this all the time. I borrow about 4-6 in one go and have 3 weeks to read and return them. That is on top of the bookring books I have and of course everything on my shelf. When I return the books I keep saying to myself "just drop the books on the librarians desk and go". That never happens, I just can't help myself looking around. I even attempted leaving my library card behind so that I can't borrow when I am returning books. But I have learnt that just giving your name and address is just fine. I used to buy all my books new but the library and charity shops are my saving grace since my husband has been out of work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frankie Posted March 16, 2010 Author Share Posted March 16, 2010 You are not alone there frankie, I do this all the time. I borrow about 4-6 in one go and have 3 weeks to read and return them. That is on top of the bookring books I have and of course everything on my shelf. When I return the books I keep saying to myself "just drop the books on the librarians desk and go". That never happens, I just can't help myself looking around. I even attempted leaving my library card behind so that I can't borrow when I am returning books. But I have learnt that just giving your name and address is just fine. I used to buy all my books new but the library and charity shops are my saving grace since my husband has been out of work. Shin, my newly found soulsister Weird that you should have only 3 weeks time to read the books, that's such a short time. I know what you mean by just not being able to leave the books and go, the bookshelves always draw me in "Just that one book I was thinking about!" "Ooh and that other one, I almost forgot!" etc. This can go on and on. You even tried leaving your library card behing, and then couldn't resist the temptation of the books and ask the librarians if you can borrow the books with just giving your name and address? Now I have to say you're worse than I am You're a complete addict!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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