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Malazan: Gardens of the Moon discussion thread (spoilers)


Karsa Orlong

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The advantage you might find with the Tor re-read is that it's being written by two people: one who's read the series before, and one who hasn't.  So there are no spoilers (although I'd advise avoiding the comments from the public).

 

yeah I was having a look through but there reviews/discussion of each chapter seem longer than the chapters themselves :roll:

 

 

You could always ask about stuff :smile:   Not saying I know all the answers, but I hope we'll be discussing the books more in these threads rather than through reviews, otherwise having these threads seems a bit of a waste :shrug:

 

Yeah I will do, I keep thinking of things to ask then promptly forgetting them :doh:

 

 

I didn't really understand the significance of 'The Eel' or Circle Breaker. I know Kruppe is The Eel... but don't know what that means :giggle2: Not sure if I missed something obvious but what did he/they do in GotM?

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yeah I was having a look through but there reviews/discussion of each chapter seem longer than the chapters themselves :roll:

True :lol:  I don't read the chapter synopses, myself, just the reviews.  I probably get more out of it because they're discussing it in such detail.  I think maybe, with the Wiki, you're in more danger of spoiling by accident  :unsure: 

 

 

 

 

I didn't really understand the significance of 'The Eel' or Circle Breaker. I know Kruppe is The Eel... but don't know what that means :giggle2: Not sure if I missed something obvious but what did he/they do in GotM?

 

The best description I've heard of those two is that The Eel is M to Circle Breaker's 007 :giggle2:   Circle Breaker doesn't do anything apart from spy on Turban Orr when he has his meetings at Despot's Barbican, and then report what he's overheard to Kruppe - er, I mean The Eel :giggle2:   It does make me laugh that Turban Orr and Baruk both think their various plots are running the city, but The Eel has got them running around in circles :D  He's got his finger in every pie, basically (and literally :lol: ).  I'll add to this as I refresh my memory reading the book :smile:   

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True :lol:  I don't read the chapter synopses, myself, just the reviews.  I probably get more out of it because they're discussing it in such detail.  I think maybe, with the Wiki, you're in more danger of spoiling by accident  :unsure:

 

Well at this stage I don't think I would know a spoiler from a general fact :giggle2: But I did use it with trepidation mainly to refresh characters and places and the wiki tells you what each character does in each book, so I didn't read past GotM.

 

 

The best description I've heard of those two is that The Eel is M to Circle Breaker's 007 :giggle2:   Circle Breaker doesn't do anything apart from spy on Turban Orr when he has his meetings at Despot's Barbican, and then report what he's overheard to Kruppe - er, I mean The Eel :giggle2:   It does make me laugh that Turban Orr and Baruk both think their various plots are running the city, but The Eel has got them running around in circles :D  He's got his finger in every pie, basically (and literally :lol: ).  I'll add to this as I refresh my memory reading the book :smile:   

 

Ah ok, that makes more sense. I think a lot of the politics was lost on me. It was difficult to know whether I should know something at the point or not, but I guess it will or become clearer one way or the other. :blush2:

 

Here's my full review

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It was difficult to know whether I should know something at the point or not

 

Probably not :D

 

 

Just been marvelling at some of the throwaway comments again.  I won't spoilerise it cos I'm not going into detail but, considering GotM was written years before the rest of the series, the mentions of the Pannion Seer and Icarium and Mappo are fairly gob-smacking :cool:

 

Just reached this bit:

 

post-6588-0-19801000-1406323117_thumb.jpg

 

All kinds of awesome.  One of many bits in this series where I have to stop, even on re-read, and think to myself "Holy hell in a handbasket, did I just read that?!" :o  :giggle2:

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Finished it last night.  A lot of great moments in the book (the rooftop assassins battle, Rake veering into a dragon for the first time to take on the Galayn demon, everything involving Dragnipur and the Hounds, Raest vs the dragons, Paran and Tool vs the Finnest, Lorn vs the Crimson Guard, Kruppe wandering around stuffing his face whilst all hell broke loose at the fete . . . :lol: ).

 

Negatives:  it's a bit rough around the edges (debut novel syndrome . . . ), the ending feels a little rushed, it's almost too enigmatic for its own good (although that's what I loved about it when I first read it). 

 

I do wonder why some 'critics' complain about the magic in these books.    

 

One thing I can't remember, maybe Laura can help:

what's the plan that Quick Ben mentions in the epilogue, that he says Whiskeyjack isn't going to like?

 

Edited by Karsa Orlong
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I'm so glad you enjoyed it Tim! :D Yeah, any time there's something you're not sure of, just ask - although chances are we won't know either, or we'll have forgotten. :giggle2:

 

One thing I can't remember, maybe Laura can help:

what's the plan that Quick Ben mentions in the epilogue, that he says Whiskeyjack isn't going to like?

 

 

Hmm. Is it to do with using the acorn at the last minute? :unsure:

 

I really will start my re-read soon. :D

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Nooo not the Finnest. The acorn thingy that Quick gives to Kalam.

 

Oh yes!  Could be! :smile:

 

 

But he didn't actually give Kalam an acorn in GotM, did he?  I've only just read it and I don't remember it happening :unsure::lol:  Must've been a set-up for it, though . . . and the Trygalle Trade Guild?

 

 

You know how to use spoiler tags, eh? :P  :giggle2:

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You know how to use spoiler tags, eh? :P  :giggle2:

 

I thought I was being cryptic! 

 

Just read the beginning of GotM in Itko Kan . . . some awesome descriptions and images, but one of the things that I've never really got is: what's with all the pigeons?

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I thought I was being cryptic!

:lol:  Far easier to use spoiler tags :P 

 

 

Just read the beginning of GotM in Itko Kan . . . some awesome descriptions and images, but one of the things that I've never really got is: what's with all the pigeons?

 

That was in Gerrom, wasn't it?  :unsure:  I think Shadowthrone sent the pigeons to stop any necromancy getting the bodies to talk (although I don't think SE explained why pigeons should stop that!) because it was the town (and building) where Sorry signed up and asked to be assigned to Dujek.  So he was covering the trail, I suppose, otherwise Lorn would've caught her straight away  :shrug:

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Just a question on the reading order of the series.

 

This is what Steve's signature says:

 

GotM > DG > MoI > HoC > MT > NoK >BH> RG > RotCG > TtH > SW > DoD > TCG > OST > B&B

This is what Wikipedia says on Malazan: Book of the Fallen.

 

The Malazan Book of the Fallen Series

1 Gardens of the Moon

2 Deadhouse Gates

3 Memories of Ice

4 House of Chains

5 Midnight Tides 940

6 The Bonehunters

7 Reaper's Gale 1280

8 Toll the Hounds

9 Dust of Dreams 1280

10 The Crippled God

 

Novellas in the series

 

Blood Follows (2002)

The Healthy Dead (2004)

The Lees of Laughter's End (2007)

Crack’d Pot Trail (2009)[8]

The Wurms of Blearmouth (2012)

 

Novels of the Malazan Empire

 

Night of Knives (2004, written by Ian Cameron Esslemont).

Return of the Crimson Guard (2008, written by Ian Cameron Esslemont).

Stonewielder (2010, written by Ian Cameron Esslemont).

Orb, Sceptre, Throne (2012 January, written by Ian Cameron Esslemont).

Blood and Bone (2012 November, written by Ian Cameron Esslemont).

Assail (2014 August, written by Ian Cameron Esslemont)[9]

 

The Kharkanas Trilogy

 

Forge of Darkness (2012), written by Steven Erikson).

Fall of Light (coming February 2015), written by Steven Erikson).

Walk in Shadow (TBA), written by Steven Erikson.

Am I then correct in assuming that the novels written by Ian Cameron Esslement should be read in between the main series written by Steven Erikson? Or is it better to read the main series first and then the novellas and the novels by Esslemont?

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That was in Gerrom, wasn't it?  :unsure:  I think Shadowthrone sent the pigeons to stop any necromancy getting the bodies to talk (although I don't think SE explained why pigeons should stop that!) because it was the town (and building) where Sorry signed up and asked to be assigned to Dujek.  So he was covering the trail, I suppose, otherwise Lorn would've caught her straight away  :shrug:

 

Oh, yeah, it did say something about them not being able to see anything . . . or something. :unsure: It's just something that's always confused me every time I've read it. :lol:

 

Am I then correct in assuming that the novels written by Ian Cameron Esslement should be read in between the main series written by Steven Erikson? Or is it better to read the main series first and then the novellas and the novels by Esslemont?

 

Steve's signature is (kind of) the chronological order of the books by both authors; some of Esslemont's books carry on with storylines that are only mentioned in the main series by Erikson, as do the novellas (I think). Some people prefer to read them in this mixed-up order, and they even read some parts of the main books at different times, since the timelines within the main series also cross over (if that makes sense :unsure: ).

 

Personally I'll probably read all of Erikson's main series, then all of Esslemont's, then the others, or else I'll just get confused. :D

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Steve's signature is (kind of) the chronological order of the books by both authors; some of Esslemont's books carry on with storylines that are only mentioned in the main series by Erikson, as do the novellas (I think). Some people prefer to read them in this mixed-up order, and they even read some parts of the main books at different times, since the timelines within the main series also cross over (if that makes sense :unsure: ).

 

Personally I'll probably read all of Erikson's main series, then all of Esslemont's, then the others, or else I'll just get confused. :D

Thanks Laura :)!

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Steve's signature is (kind of) the chronological order of the books by both authors; some of Esslemont's books carry on with storylines that are only mentioned in the main series by Erikson, as do the novellas (I think).

The order in my sig (apparently) avoids spoilers as you go along, but it's not definitive or anything  :shrug:  If you don't read the ICE books then you get to the end of the SE sequence without closure on at least one major plotline (possibly more, as I've only read the first two of his so far).  It's just a shame ICE's writing is nowhere near as good - I managed to finish the main sequence and was wondering what had happened to a particular character, completely forgetting that they had been dealt with in Return of the Crimson Guard.  That's how memorable that book was! :giggle2:

 

The novellas contain two characters from the MoI, but the storylines don't carry over :smile:

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The order in my sig (apparently) avoids spoilers as you go along, but it's not definitive or anything  :shrug:  If you don't read the ICE books then you get to the end of the SE sequence without closure on at least one major plotline (possibly more, as I've only read the first two of his so far).  It's just a shame ICE's writing is nowhere near as good - I managed to finish the main sequence and was wondering what had happened to a particular character, completely forgetting that they had been dealt with in Return of the Crimson Guard.  That's how memorable that book was! :giggle2:

 

The novellas contain two characters from the MoI, but the storylines don't carry over :smile:

Thanks Steve :)

 

That's the way I'm planning on doing it :)

I think I will do the same. I will order some the next time I order books online.

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The novellas contain two characters from the MoI, but the storylines don't carry over :smile:

 

Ah, I've only ever read one (possibly two) of the novellas (BF & THD?), and I don't remember a lot from them. I seem to remember that I didn't really enjoy them all that much, though I'm not sure why.

 

I think I will do the same. I will order some the next time I order books online.

 

Yay! :D

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I'm still ploughing through - I'm finding it really slow going, probably because I can't wait to get to some of the later books! I'd almost forgotten how disjointed and challenging GotM is, and even though I still love it, I'd say it's easily the weakest book of the entire series by far.

 

I'd forgotten how much I love the Darujhistan crowd, though. :D

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I'm still ploughing through - I'm finding it really slow going, probably because I can't wait to get to some of the later books! I'd almost forgotten how disjointed and challenging GotM is, and even though I still love it, I'd say it's easily the weakest book of the entire series by far.

 

I'd forgotten how much I love the Darujhistan crowd, though. :D

 

What I've noticed about it on each re-read is how small scale it is compared with what follows.  A bit like comparing Tyrion to Gregor Clegane :giggle2:

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How far are you into the book?

 

330 pages, almost halfway through. It's strange, because about this time last year I re-read / read the entire series all in one go, so most of the events just sort of fade into one long story. I'd forgotten which characters were in which books, so I sort of keep getting surprised by who is/isn't the book, and what does or doesn't happen. :lol:

 

I'm still enjoying it a lot, though largely because of the amount of stuff that only makes sense after having read the whole series. Even just the tiny little hints of what's to come - it's amazing. :D

 

What I've noticed about it on each re-read is how small scale it is compared with what follows.  A bit like comparing Tyrion to Gregor Clegane :giggle2:

 

:lol: Yeah, I know what you mean!

 

That's encouraging  :D

 

Yeah, I meant it in the best possible way! :D

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