Maureen

Hey Kell, lots of love and Congrats to you all XXX

Thanks Pontalba - however it is you guys who take part, who deserve most of the credit.

I would like to thank everyone who took part in this month's circle, it was an enjoyable discussion. Please note that this thread remains open for anyone who would like to share their thoughts about this book.

I do think this is not a book to start if you are going through a hectic/busy/emotional time in your life. It needs full attention and a calm state of mind to be enjoyed in my opinion.

9. In your opinion, did this book deserve the Man Booker Prize? Was it an enjoyable read? Will you be reading the sequel - Bring up the bodies? I enjoyed reading the book - this period of British History really fascinates me, and I find the lives of these characters to be so interesting and dynamic. I do think that Mantel's fresh portrayal of Cromwell is suberb, so rich and alive, it is as if she were living in the same period. I do think her book deserving of the Man Booker Prize - although I did not find it easy to read in the beginning, as soon as I got used to her writing style, I enjoyed it tremendously. I think I will be reading the sequel very soon - and according to comments in this tread, it should be just as good as this one.

8. What are your feelings about Cromwell after having read this book? Overall, Cromwell is shown to be a nice person. I loved the way he took care of his family, how much he loved his wife and children, and how he made it a point to be as different to his father as regards to his family as possible. I also admired him for helping Mary Boleyn when she wanted to start over a new life, and helping her get an annuity, which as he said, she deserved, as she worked for it 'on her back'. He also showed compassion to various other people, for example he took in Helen Barre and her children, and the boy Christophe from Calais, he was always kind to people in need. Notwitstanding his generous nature, he also had a hard streak in him as well - he never forgave Henry Percy for his treatment of the cardinal and he made sure that when the time was right, Percy was made to pay for his deeds.

Yes, for that, the title is very apt.

True....however, more than selfish or selfless, I felt that he would sacrifice his principles to do his job without hesitation - in some instances I felt that he had twinges of regrets as regards Queen Caterine and her daughter Mary. Perhaps, after all, this shows that he was the best man for the job he was chosen for.

7. Why does Cromwell dislike the Catholic clergy? What are his motives for helping Henry marry Anne Boleyn and sever ties to the Pope? What larger goals does he hope to achieve in helping? Are they selfless...or selfish? (from litlovers.com) I picked this question because I really want to know what other people think about this. While reading the book, I did not really think that Cromwell disliked the Catholic clergy so much – he loved to lock horns with any person who stood in the way of what he wanted to achieve, be it a catholic priest, a queen, a princess or a pauper. In my opinion he transformed England from a Catholic state to a Protestant State so that he would get what he really wanted – an annulment for the King, which would give him such a boost in the King’s esteem. I do not really believe that he wanted to help the King get a male heir for the good of the country – although he worked hard to make that happen.

6. In terms of the writing, a number of reviewers felt the difficulty of too many Thomases and too many he's - that Mantel didn't make the effort to help readers through the confusion. Do you agree? Did you find other difficulties in reading the work...or did you find her prose clear... and engaging? How else might you describe Mantel's writing? Q6 from cambridgelibraries.ca I found this to be true - I filled the book with notes and bookmarks so that I could make head or tails of the he in the particular passage - but what Pontalba says is true, usually 'he ' refers to Cromwell - irrespective of who the sentence started about. I believe Mantel could have made it easier on the reader - there were times where I had to read particular pages more than once so that I could sort everything out in my head. I loved her dark humour thoroughout the book though, it made for an interesting slant on a very important period in history.

5. What do you think about the title - 'Wolf Hall'? According to Wikipedia, I must admit that although this is a clever play on words, it's significance did not strike me as particularly important....

Ooshie, that's true - children were a currency - the way the Bolyen's family treated Mary was shocking beyond belief.

4. What is your impression of Cromwell's feelings about Anne Boleyn? What do you think about her? In Anne Boleyn, Cromwell found a key to a successful future. She is portrayed as a scheming and conniving person, who would go to great lengths to realise her dream - which was in no way trifling. Cromwell realised that as the King's desire for a male heir was getting stronger and more desperate, and Anne Boleyn was a strong ambitious person who could give him the necessary push to step on unchartered territory by pandering to his vanity and his lust, he had been dealt a fortunate hand, which he could use to his own advancement. Sometimes I got the feeling that he felt a kind of sorry for Anne, for in the scheme of things, she was after all only a means to an end, but that did not stop him from supporting her in her plans - he knew he was backing a winning horse

Imagine how different history would have been, had Cromwell managed to persuade More to the King's case! Pontalba, there was a paragraph in particular when More's wife was talking about More and his daughter from a previous wife - and she did refer to a special relationship between her husband and his daughter - she sort of commented about how his daughter knew more of what undergarments More wore than she, his wife, did...

3. What do you think about Cromwell's relationship with Thomas More? With Cardinal Thomas Wolsey? In other books I read, Thomas More came across as a nicer,certainly more humane, person, sometimes even a bit of a martyr, whereas in this book he sort of comes across as a calculating, cold hearted, religious fanatic. Cromwell and More serve at opposing ends, with Cromwell backing the rise of Queen Anne, while More refusing to budge in his support for Queen Katherine which makes their relationship as difficult as could be. However Cromwell does his best to give More as much comfort as possible during his incarceration, and ample time and opportunities for redemption, while at the same time he also strives to let him keep as much of his pride as possible. I think, if not the best of friendships, their relationship showed respect. On the other hand Cardinal Thomas Wolsey was, in fact, the father Cromwell never had. Cromwell loved and respected the cardinal, and served him faithfully till the end. Wolsey treated him like a beloved son at times, and helped him rise from a nobody to a respected lawyer, and eventually when Wolsey fell from the King's grace, replaced him as the King's trusted aide, and was the champion of 'His Great Matter'.

He does look a bit like a murderer, doesn't he?

I particulary loved parts where Cromwell's humane side is show - for example when he visited the Master of the Rolls' house, he was with his young servant, who saw and tore up a spiderweb and Cromwell calls him a heartless boy as he had broken up the spider's home. I also loved the fact that he was a loving husband and father especially during this period in time, when being faithful was not the order of the day, and the realtionship between fathers and their children was quite cold and factual. Unfortunately he lost his wife and two children, but he 'made' another family with his wards and employees, and gave them as much comfort, security and attention as possible.

They are lovely Chrissy. A typical figolla would be around 15-20 cms long, and around 17 cms wide, although that is a very rough estimate as they come in all shapes and sizes. Usually they are decorated with icining and or chocolate and a chocolate egg is put on top. The size of the helping varies... depending - mine is always very generous I love figolli.

1. There are many and varied historical accounts of Cromwell’s life. Did you find his portrayal as a sympathetic character surprising and believable? I cannot say I read a lot of historical accounts of Cromwell's life, fictional or non-fictional, so perhaps I am not the best critic for this one, but I liked the way Cromwell was portrayed. There is no doubt at all that he led an interesting and eventful life, was a great lawyer and was a people person, so I guess being a sympathetic character would be believable and also probable. However I do think that his ambition, aggressive behaviour and self preservation must have been greater than those depicted in Wolf Hall, qualities which must have been a pre-requisite for a successful lawyer and advisor to Henry Tudor. 2. Do you think that Hilary Mantel successfully merges historical fact with the narrative? Yes, I believe Hilary Mantel has successfully woven facts and ficion in this novel. For example I love the way she created an early life for Cromwell - a period of his life about which not much fact is documented.

It is assumed that you have read the book before reading posts in this thread, as the discussion might give away crucial points, and the continuous use of spoiler tags might hinder fluent reading of posts. Wolf Hall by Hilary Mantel Winner of the Man Booker Prize 2009 'Lock Cromwell in a deep dungeon in the morning,' says Thomas More, 'and when you come back that night he'll be sitting on a plush cushion eating larks' tongues, and all the gaolers will owe him money.' England, the 1520s. Henry VIII is on the throne, but has no heir. Cardinal Wolsey is his chief advisor, charged with securing the divorce the pope refuses to grant. Into this atmosphere of distrust and need comes Thomas Cromwell, first as Wolsey's clerk, and later his successor. Cromwell is a wholly original man: the son of a brutal blacksmith, a political genius, a briber, a charmer, a bully, a man with a delicate and deadly expertise in manipulating people and events. Ruthless in pursuit of his own interests, he is as ambitious in his wider politics as he is for himself. His reforming agenda is carried out in the grip of a self-interested parliament and a king who fluctuates between romantic passions and murderous rages. From one of our finest living writers, ‘Wolf Hall’ is that very rare thing: a truly great English novel, one that explores the intersection of individual psychology and wider politics. With a vast array of characters, and richly overflowing with incident, it peels back history to show us Tudor England as a half-made society, moulding itself with great passion, suffering and courage. Welcome to April's book circle. I think we have a very interesting choice this month, with lots of potential for discussion. There are also a number of discussion questions online, some of which I will borrow. 1. There are many and varied historical accounts of Cromwell’s life. Did you find his portrayal as a sympathetic character surprising and believable? 2. Do you think that Hilary Mantel successfully merges historical fact with the narrative? Q 1 & 2 From book coasters (Gold Coast Library) 3. What do you think about Cromwell's relationship with Thomas More? With Cardinal Thomas Wolsey? 4. What is your impression of Cromwell's feelings about Anne Boleyn? What do you think about her? 5. What do you think about the title - 'Wolf Hall'? 6. In terms of the writing, a number of reviewers felt the difficulty of too many Thomases and too many he's - that Mantel didn't make the effort to help readers through the confusion. Do you agree? Did you find other difficulties in reading the work...or did you find her prose clear... and engaging? How else might you describe Mantel's writing? Q6 from cambridgelibraries.ca 7. Why does Cromwell dislike the Catholic clergy? What are his motives for helping Henry marry Anne Boleyn and sever ties to the Pope? What larger goals does he hope to achieve in helping? Are they selfless...or selfish? (from litlovers.com) 8. What are your feelings about Cromwell after having read this book?

Turkey breast with mushroom sauce, potatoes and salad. A piece of figolla for dessert.

Me too

A mango